Woodstock made it rock again!

I know that some units have a bimetallic that is used only during initial firing to increase air supply to get the unit burning clean. Then, after a period of time it is closed fully and the users operates a more traditional air control (damper). A great guy and dear friend that started Quad had a patent on that design so many years ago.

 

The original Vermont Castings' engineers had the "bimetallic" temp devices on their cat stoves way back in the ancient 90's.
When the Randolph, VT owners made their cat stoves they worked well ONLY when all the systems were in sync: cat, gaskets, air, draft.
Over the years we had a few of the original VC Encores for 24/7 heating. High maintenance, but doable.
We tried the new Flexburns with 2 unworkable failures; QC or just plain too cute engineering and over marketing.
The BK and perhaps Woodstock temp controls are not the VC bimetallic device. Different, and better; I looked.
Unfortunately, the BK stove requirements for spacing behind the unit would not fit into our sites. And, after many years of cat
use ( all be it older VC tech), we went to non cat "tube" Jotuls.
Thx Chris !

 

They still work off of a similar principle. There are stove manufacturers that have used bi-metallics longer than VC, though some of these companies are defunct.

I’m not sure how BK and Earth stove are related, if they ever were at all. I don’t know about BK but I’m pretty sure Earth stove used one as well. Not sure how long. Not sure when they stopped making stoves.

Bi-metallics have been on some stoves a long time. Some are slight variations on a similar technology. Coal stoves have used them for long time. Some of these companies are defunct, but their stoves rock on...some approaching 50-60 years and those thermostats are still working.

 

The Princ

First, companies were not related. Second, Lennox bought Earthstove and closed it down. Third, all the bimetallic springs in the old days were "off the shelf". We know, we sold them to other companies.

Ours are unique. Length, revolutions, duration in the oven and baking Temps are specific to each model. Don't try the wrong model spring in a different model...it won't work.

A competitor bought one of our units about 8 years ago, in advance of EPA's recent rule making. The guy calls me up and says, "hey, bought your xxxx model, shoved your thermostat into my yyyy model, got better burn times, but could not control top end heat output. He said it was too costly to keep trying, just going to manual damper...and he did.

 

Right that bi metallic temp devices have been around for decades. Many recall the wonder of creosote producing Ashley stoves.
But give the engineers and designers at the Vermont Vermont Castings team some credit for development of efficiency, style, and clean burning tech for decades before they were bought.
Then the quality and exceptional customer service deteriorated by the buyers as well as better tech and service from other makers like BK and Woodstock.
The original VC Vermont crew did develop a bimetallic secondary air control for allowing a cat to keep "lit" for example. Air passages for heated air to fill more mass of casts. Top loading without smoke spill.
Those stoves were over engineered. Having rebuilt a couple, it was a wet pants experience.
There have been few companies like the Randolph, VT VC that became a near cult with annual parties.

 

Rather than a bimetallic coil I suspect we will see a simple thermo controller that uses a thermocouple, a little stepper motor, and a computer to open and close the intakes. The coil works great on my bk but as was said, it’s no easy task to apply this technology and the function is great for actual daily use and to keep emissions low.

But yes, will need batteries or line power.

 

Any device needs the K.I.S.S. rule. Complexity easily can look great, but remember Goldberg's Rule of anything:
MURPHY WAS AN OPTIMIST.
It's why we decided to go with non cats for 24/7 heating.
Our new "improved" Outback has so many bells and whistles that there is nothing in the manual for the blowing your nose function.
Thimk (not think) about M Word, how much of the thousands of functions does anyone actually use ?

 

Did you mean”The Princ” to be your choice of the 3 stoves? Just curious. If so, why? Deeper stove more room for ash? Your own personal preference or for other reasons?

Thanks for allowing me to “pick your brain”.

 

Huh?

You’re going to have to keep your post a little more simple for me. Having my brain to work too hard. LOL! Outback? M word?? Thimk??

Keep It Simple for me Simon.

You have which model Jotul? How are you liking it? I came a hair of buying the one you can put the grill in the top of...mainly because that’s the only top model Jotul the place had beside the VC stoves. I think I’d really like the top load feature.

 

Backwoods, by the way, that Fireview is one beautiful stove.

 

MS Word ( missed the "S" for simple ).
"THIMK" was an IBM marketing slogan before your time .
Now as for the "Simon", the Jotul model ( Rangely ) is in the list.
And, if you were from the Northeast, you would know that "Outback" is a Subaru wagon....not Australian barbie. Subaru models are second only to the F150 ( sorry, Ford ) in Maine.

Like most products there are pros and cons. We had a Jotul Oslo for serious heating for about 15 years with a couple of VC Encores over the years. The Oslo was a Great, simple to use, large ash pan, and easy to maintain stove.
Though it was used hard for 24/7 heat, nothing had to be replaced except for the usual gaskets, a few cracked bricks, and bolt tightening. It was sold
in fine shape to a sporting camp in northern Maine.
The Rangelys ( we have 2 ) have a top loading option which is too small for normal use. Also the ash pan is small for the firebox size, and has some problems with the latch
if not cleaned and graphited ( is that a word ? ) periodically.

Whatya thimk ?

 

Old enough to remember and use a Commodore 64, andbtimes even before then, remember when IBM’s were actually popular, use Tandy, and remember McIntosch and Apple’s. This all before Ross Pero became a household name in his bid to throw off an election. I always like the old man, but knew it was a wasted vote. His famous forgotten words, “our man is in”. He wanted Clinton in office, imho.

Familiar with Subaru’s and the Outback. The lesbian car of choice. ( Not a knock on you or lesbians. ... I don’t care how people live.) Just wasn’t sure how it was related to the conversation. Actually, I find a lot of your posts are jibberish to me. No offense of course. Just don’t often understand what you write, that’s all. There’s your sign...others may think the same. Again, no offense meant by that. Just an observation. Would love to visit Maine. In an...F-150.

So, I take it you still prefer the top load of the VC over Jotul’s? I’m not sure I remember any other top load Jotul’s without visiting their web site.

Care to elaborate on the “bolt tightening”?

 

Whew Hoyt, can't please all the people .......
If you don't care how "people live", why bring it up ? So Subaru is doing lesbo marketing ? Who the F knew ?

Now for some simple talk. The top load of the Jotul Rangely is a narrow limited opening compared to our old VC Encores top load which allowed for a full firebox load whether burning or not. It was an excellent design. Was.

If you've used cast wood stoves, they are usually bolted together and the plate joints sealed with furnace cement or better, gasketing ( Morso ). It is or was the common way to make a cast plate wood stove.
In time with heavy use the bolts can loosen with expansion and contraction. (e.g. the Oslo ash pan azz'y is bolted to the base of the Oslo ) . How's this explanation ?
What's this, "jibberish" ?

 

I must have had a brain fart when I asked about the bolts. I told your posts confused me. LOL...but yeah, I know what you mean about the plates being bolted together. Just never considered folks had to pay that much attention to bolt coming loose. I figured resealing the seams was more of a concern.

 

You are forgiven. The penance for the B.F. will be your call( e.g. a benjamin will be fine ).
P.S. The plates can be resealed ( rebuilding is a PITA ) only by taking the stove apart. The Jotul Rangely is both welded internally and cast. I will never do another rebuilt...ever.

 

Lots of modern "cast iron" stoves are really welded steel plate stoves with a second layer of cast iron sort of hung onto some tabs around the stove. The cast iron in this case is for looks, some thermal mass, and to create that cool vented double wall construction with convection and reduced clearances. Thank god the old bolt together with snot seam sealer stoves are becoming obsolete.

 

No snot seams, no obsolete....yet.
Look at how many wood stoves are made still such as Morso, VC and others. Old, but proven tech that works well ( except for VC).
Yes, my Rangelys are hung casts. Hung .

 

Ok, so I didn't read every post in this thread, but i did read a couple pages worth. What has this done for stove prices? I know they will go up but by how much?

 

Hey BKVP, why don't you team up with Woodstock and make a Woodstock Progress Hybrid BK Special!

Your welcome!