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What happens when pellets have high moisture in top feed pellet stove - Auger Jam - see pics

Discussion in 'Pellet Stoves, Pellet Fireplaces, Pellet Furnaces' started by don2222, Mar 30, 2018.

  1. don2222

    don2222

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    Just the other day, I was working on a Harman Advance. The stove stopped working and the girl opened the glass hopper lid and the room filled with smoke. First time I have heard of that!
    I found that the Igniter Failed when lighting the pellets and shorted out causing the fuse on the main circuit board to blow out. This stopped all power to the stove and the Combustion blower stopped blowing the smoke out the vent pipe!
    Therefore, I installed a new Igniter and a black in-line fuse holder from Home Depot on the yellow Igniter wire with a 4 amp fuse so if or when this happens again the 4 amp Igniter fuse will blow and the 6 amp Circuit Board fuse will keep the fans and stove going. Then the stove. An be lit with gel manually until the Igniter is replaced. :)

    What do you think? See Pic
     

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  2. heat seeker

    heat seeker

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    Good idea - I did the same thing on my stove.
     
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  3. krooser

    krooser

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    I have a St Croix Pepin.

    I've never had a problem with pellet jams even when I purposely used pellets that had been wet. I simply dried them out and mixed in the bad pellets (now sawdust) with new pellets and they burned fine. Of course I had to break up the clods of pellets... I kinda cheap!
     
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  4. Chickenman

    Chickenman

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    With our stoves and HHT stoves out here we have an issue with fines blockages at the top of the drop chute.
    This is not related to moisture. A sealed bag will not have moist pellets. The problem is from too many long pellets. Pellets under 3/4" long are great but we get plenty over 1 1/2" long. These long buggers get crunched up by the auger and the fines are transported to the top of the auger where they accumulate. These fines develop into a plug which eventually blocks the auger and either breaks the shear pin or auger gearbox.
    I recommend to all (our very few pellet burning customers) not to use these crappy pellets but often it is their only option in which case I advise having a piece of wire with a bent end which you poke up the drop chute and scratch around each time before lighting. It takes about 5 secs and I have never had anyone who does it have problems again.
    It is like the simple cleaning. With the tiny bit of cleaning shown in the video below and the SmartBurn installed I haven't needed to look at my chimney in over 3 years. Before we had to clean it at least once per season.



    Prevention is far cleaner and quicker than cure with pellet stoves.
     
  5. don2222

    don2222

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    Here is more info on wood pellet moisture
    From this link
    http://vi.raptor.ebaydesc.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemDescV4&item=351077927721&category=41987&pm=1&ds=0&t=1505364295000&ver=0

    WOOD PELLET MOISTURE TESTER

    TEST for MOISTURE in all WOOD PELLETS You Purchase Look for 4-10% MOISTURE CONTENT or less WHEN YOU PURCHASE YOUR WOOD PELLETS

    Use this Wood Pellet Moisture Tester to test all the Wood Pellets you find or use. Your wood pellets should have between 4 to 10% or less mositure. This is a wood tester that is programmed for either wood pellet testing, wood chip testing, or saw dust testing. (We have cheaper Grain Testers that will work with wood pellets). It will test for 4 to 23% Moisture in Wood Pellets, 15 to 65% Moisture in Wood Chips, and 6 to 30% for Saw Dust. You need to search for DRY Wood Pellets at approximately 4-10 % DRYNESS or dryer to burn well in a pellet stove. Most wood pellet bags come in air-tight plastic bags ranging 4-10% Moisture content. Some warehouses have high humidity and moisture, and if the bags are not air-tight sealed, moisture will creep in. Also your supplier may inadvertenly slip you some WET Wood Pellets and you should have a way of monitoring that. Note that your pellet Stove, Furnace or Boiler will run much better with 4-10% (or less) DRY Wood Pellets and the dryer the wood pellets, the higher your BTU/Hr output. High moisture wood pellets can become impacted and jam the auger and/or auger shaft. High moisture wood pellets will crush into a dough-like putty and crate JAMS galore! High moisture wood pellets can also cause clinkers in the fire pot, a characteristic normally indentified only with corn-burning. . Dry wood pellets can help eliminate costly agitator and auger repair, burn higher BTU output, and save you money in the long run. A MOISTURE TESTER is used by people that own and operate Pellet and Multifuel Stoves, Inserts, Furnaces, Boilers, or any device that burns pellets or corn.

    FURTHER NOTE: we sell cheaper Grain Testers that will work with wood pellets. You can buy an upgraded Grain Tester model that will test from 5 to 40% Moisture in around 16 grains where grain settings 5, 7, 11 test similar to wood pellets... and it is far less costly than a wood-pellet tester -- see Option (2). NOTE: We also sell a CORN Moisture Tester at a lower price, and it will also test for wood pellet moisture. Check out our other Corn and Pellet Stove items listed in our Ebay Store. Visit My eBay Store: Corn Pellet Stove Furnace Boiler

    MOISTURE TESTING RESULTS for Fuel King Premium Hardwood Pellets (Blue Plastic 40 lb Bag) tested out to be less than 5% Moisture. They burn good, are premium hardwood, and are the right length 1/2 to 3/4 inches. Fuel King, the blue-bag company, is a division of Midwest Sawdust, Inc, P.O. Box 883, Spencer, IA 51301 and you can contact them.

    OPTIONS:

    (1) CORN MOISTURE TESTER $175, (2) WIDER TESTING RANGE: For a wider testing range of 5 to 40% for 16 grains where grain settings 5, 7, and 11 can be used to test similar to wood pellets and it is priced at $299, (some people use this instead to test wood pellets!), or (3) MULTIGRAIN MOISTURE TESTER that will test 39 to 40 grains for $349 in a mosture range of 5-40%. A picture of it is the same as it looks physically identical to the Corn Stove Moisture Tester. It will include testing of grains such as: corn, big red hard wheat, oats, soy beans, barley, sun flower seeds, olives pits, cherry pits, etc...
     
  6. kappel15

    kappel15

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    I am burning pellets, that have been in my cold storage shop, that are at least 5 years old(hate getting senile). No issues. kap
     
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  7. don2222

    don2222

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    That is good, but you may not have anything to compare them with?
    One of my techs just got some Cubex and she says there is not much heat compared to the Vermont pellets she had, and the Douglass Firs had unbelievable amount of heat!
    I myself can barely tell the difference but some people especially women can really tell the difference!
    So I have to go with what they say and I do know that the moisture content makes a huge difference.
    As soon as I find a Pellet Moisture Meter that works well and does not cost a fortune I will buy it so I can measure the Difference!!!
     
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  8. kappel15

    kappel15

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    There is a difference in quality from one brand to another, and also from one batch to another of the same brand. And if they have sat out in the rain at the retail store, without the cover on them. kap
     
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  9. Chickenman

    Chickenman

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    Just back from a holiday in old Blighty. Just about beaten the jetlag :headbang:

    Moisture in pellets is far less an issue than in grain as the airflow ratio is much higher and generally the pellets fall to bits if they are too damp. Of course dry pellets are better no question.

    Just cooling off here and the stove sales are starting to ramp up as the punters start getting cold at night.:bug:
     
  10. don2222

    don2222

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    That is true but I had 2 or 3 cases of moisture jams this past season. Not much compared to all the stoves we serviced. However it does make it difficult to diagnose. Two of the moisture jams were in the drop chutes of older St Croix stoves with the small opening from the auger chute into the drop chute. St Croix did admit that the drop chute opening should be larger in a written letter to one of my customers! In this case I documented above, I was fortunate to be able to take a good picture that shows the pellets stuck together in the very top of the drop chute so you cAn see the jam! This customer stored the pellets outside on an open porch with a roof. After getting new pellets and storing them inside, the problem stopped. The new auger motor would not have been ruined if the new pellets were used sooner!
    Also I kept a ton and 1/2 of pellets in a walk out basement over a very humid summer and they did not burn as hot the next season. People living in a dry climate would not see this problem.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2018
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  11. kappel15

    kappel15

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    Have a customer leave pellets in stove, which means the auger is full. Then a storm knocks the exhaust weird, causing rain to run down on top of stove and fills hopper with water and seeps up the auger tube, expanding all the pellets till the tube is packed tight. Then they dry before customer discovers it. Like dam cement!:hair::headbang::picard:
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2018
  12. don2222

    don2222

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    Oh Yes
    I worked on a stove in a house built in the 1700s and it was located on the 1st floor over a dirt crawl space. There was a dirt floor less than 2 feet under it! The same thing happened so the pellets and sawdust in the versa grate hardened like cement over the spring and summer just like yours! It really was just like cement and the versa grate would not move!!!
     
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  13. Lousyweather

    Lousyweather

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    Did you check the triac on the board? Alot of times when the igniter blows it will destroy the triac on the board as well as the fuse. The triac, when shot, can actually cause the new igniter to stay on all the time.....even if the light is off. Put a loop tester on the igniter when it shuts off and see if its still powered......can cause the burnpot to bubble up as well (too much heat with igniter on all the time)
     
  14. don2222

    don2222

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    Good point
    Would the Igniter led on the CB stay on if the Igniter triad was shorted?
     
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  15. Lousyweather

    Lousyweather

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    It could either stay on or stay off....only way to tell is to look for current when you know the igniter should be off (ie: a good fire in the stove)...a loop meter will easily tell you this without unhooking anything
     
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  16. Scot Linkletter

    Scot Linkletter

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    That's going to be difficult to find. Most hand-held moisture meters that work with wood are made for sawdust and won't read below 20% moisture.
    I have a hand-held meter that comes from Poland which will read down to 8% which is good for testing furnish.

    For more accurate readings, mills use something like the Max 5000XL for lab testing and the GreCon IR 5000 for process control.
    But even those don't measure moisture in pellet form. Pellets need to be ground up first before testing.
     
  17. don2222

    don2222

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  18. Scot Linkletter

    Scot Linkletter

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    That's an interesting device. I'd be curious to see how its results compare with a lab quality device like the Max 5000XL.
     
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  19. Chickenman

    Chickenman

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    I've got a moisture meter I use for grain and pits to know when I have dried them sufficiently.
    I could calibrate it for pellets but have never bothered as pellets are fine as long as they hold together. Add moisture and they fall apart. We use wood pellets for cat litter it is fantastic, but too expensive to put through our stoves.
     
  20. don2222

    don2222

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    See if you can calibrate the meter for pellets. This past season I saw 3 customer stoves that had pellets with too much moisture even though they looked good and held together fine. Two of the Pellet Stoves were St Croixs with a smaller opening in the drop chute. The pellets swelled and stuck together and jammed the auger even though one stove had a brand new hi Quality Gleason Avery 2 RPM auger motor! The customer kept trying it which made the jam so bad, grease leaked out around the auger motor shaft which means the bearings started to go so the auger motor had to be replaced! If I had a moisture meter, I could have measured the pellets and know that what percentage of moisture caused this problem!

    Customer threw the bad pellets out and bought new pellets and the stove has been running fine!
     
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