papadave, all I want to add is to make sure your choice fits you. I mean, make sure it feels natural when shouldering it, the controls are where you like them (safeties- tang or trigger), the fore-end is comfortable, and length of pull- too long can be a bugger at times. The 870 or 500/590 debate could go on for a while, they all are well made these days. My input for home defense, 3" chamber, short length of pull on the butt (but not a pistol grip), 18.5" barrel, extra mag. capacity, tritium front sight. A side saddle shell carrier if you want. JB
There the same thing. Some guys like me dont say magnum behind the size some do. Its a marketing thing. I own both. A Moss Berg 500 and an 870 super express mag or whatever they call it. I like the safety location on the 500 but the 870 I think is a more durable gun when you start talking thousands of rounds through it. The 500 actions get wobbly and the pump rattles on them all over the years. Have yet to see many 870s that do it. And the action gets loose for the pump part , at least my 500is that way but it was bought with an iunknown quantity of rounds thru it. I have a short 18" barrel on it now loaded with buckshot. Oh and buy the 12. Resale will be higher and shells cheaper and easier to find. Unless your in love with the " sweetheart" calibers for upland birds there is no sense unless for a kid to buy anything other than a 12. More lead and they dont hurt. That a movie thing the blow you across the room thing. Well I mean if your shooting 3.5s time after time yes they hurt but who does that? Unless your pattering your turkey gun or shooting ducks.
I agree. I sold a 10 gauge for that reason. Ammo was $$ and hard to find. Only shotgun I have is a 1980s Mossberg 500 "clone" (Western Auto) that I paid $75 for. I load it with slugs and keep it by the pillow in the tent when camping just in case Yogi decides I smell good. 20 gauge or .410 are good for small game (partridge, rabbit, etc) though you can get pretty light loads for a 12 gauge too.
Not sure if she'll even pick it up, let alone shoot it, but my wife MAY use this. How much more of a kick does a 12 have over the 20? I know you guys will probably say it's no big deal, but be honest. JB, you just described the one I'd like to get, except for the extra mag capacity. I've hoisted a couple at my brother's, and don't care for the long barrel. Don't need it. If I do at some point in the future, I can always get one. When I was a very young person, the one I bought was a single shot .410. Plenty of force to kill a wabbit.
Felt recoil will vary with 12 vs 20, the weight of the gun and the shooter... I'll throw another idea out for you -- a semi auto -- a gas operated semi auto will reduce the felt recoil.... Might look at the mossberg sa-20. They make several barrel lengths, tactical and bantam or youth models. And it is a semi auto 20 gauge.
I have an 870 express. My first and only shotgun. I have a 20" improved cylinder barrel for deer hunting and 28" screw-in for buckshot hunting. I will be putting a scope on it this year too, which couldn't be easier with the mounting kit. The 870 is the Stihl 290 of shotguns. Ultra reliable workhorse that is "good" for about anything. Unless you are waterfowl hunting you really don't need a SuperMag. Mag is nice but not necessary for deer and turkey hunting. Mag and SuperMag ammo is $$ compared to 2 3/4". There's not a ton of recoil difference between a 12 and 20. I would get the 12. If recoil is a concern get and 1187 or similar model (semi-auto). The recoil difference is noticeably less over a pump action. EDIT: Mossbergs are just as good as Remington in this arena. You can't go wrong with either.
My wife shoots mine and is not scares of the 12. Now I dont load it up with buckshot. Andmy sis in law. Shoot a 12 at clays and iIl bet she is not more than 100-120 pounds and 5'2". Now she may not want to shoot a box of anything but she can shoot it no prob. I'm telling you its all movie hype. There is a reason you give your 8 yr old a .410 and your young teen a 20 they have less kick but any adult can comfortably shoot a 12. Me id buy a 12. If recoil is a huge concern get an auto. But be prepared to spend 3x as much.
Yes, and no. I think some police packages have a short barrel but they really need the long barrel for the action to cycle reliably. I wouldn't trust an "off the shelf" semi-auto with a short barrel. I'm sure there are some people who can make it work, but it would require some gunsmithing. EDIT: There might be a 18.5" factory short barrel, but I'm not sure either way. Worth a look.
Dave here's a link for you Ithaca makes a really nice shot gun I own 2 deer slayer models you can get these short barrel 20ga. http://ithacagun.com/defense37s.html
Find someone with a 12 that you can shoot. Go to a range and strike up a conversation. Anyone usually will let you shoot their gun a few times. I do from time to time and been offered and shot plenty of cool things just by talking to guys. Never asking. Many ranges rent guns too. I bet u can find a shotgun to shoot.
870 is the go to gun for sure. Most hunters have owned, or do own one. I am a prior owner and the person I sold mine to must give me the option to repurchase if he sells. You can get an 18 inch barrel for this gun. If you are using for home defense, a smooth bore slug barrel would spread buckshot nicely for home defense. I also strongly recommend a pump gun over a semi-auto if a novice user is involved. Semi-auto can put the shooter in an unexpected position of having a live round in a gun with a safety off following a shot. Pumps hold the expired shell until the shooter makes the effort to cycle in the next live shell.
"I also strongly recommend a pump gun over a semi-auto if a novice user is involved. Semi-auto can put the shooter in an unexpected position of having a live round in a gun with a safety off following a shot. Pumps hold the expired shell until the shooter makes the effort to cycle in the next live shell." Something I hadn't thought of...thanks.
Shotgun fit is paramount for felt recoil. I have close to 500,000 rounds through a lot of different guns. The same shells kick a lot less in my Rizinni then they do in my buddies Beretta. One of my favorite guns to shoot is a Rem. 1100 It was my first shotgun bought new when I was 12. If trained correctly the semi autos are no more dangerous than a single shot. The 1100 is a gas operated action and will not kick near a much as a pump gun. One of my favorite guns these days is a 28 ga. Rizinni it is built on a true small ga. receiver @ 5.? pounds and almost no recoil. I have hit crossing clays at 65 yds. and it will crush them as well as a 12 ga. If you hit them. I reload all of my shells to produce 1250 fps. so my leads stay the same with whatever gun I chose to shoot that day. There are some good recoil calculators out there if you know the weight of the gun, projectile weight and weight of powder charge.http://handloads.com/calc/recoil.asp
papadave, where are you in Northern Mi. There is a shoot coming up in Manton you could test run a few different guns at.
If you want to make the drive I can hook you up with a few to try. It will be the first Sat. in March.
Thanks Fifelaker. My sis-in-law is coming up that weekend, and my time is promised to her to help work on her house. I may even try to get out in the woods over there to cut some more. Enjoy the shoot. Like I said earlier, there's a range about a mile from me, and I can go with my brother sometime. I'll have to buy some shells for that.
