First Fire In New Stove Guidelines Please

I'm going to go with this as well.

Once I talked to an expert (Englander tech) and got some good dry wood, I was finally able get my 30-NC up to temp after about 6 tries. If I can do it with dry wood and a 4' chimney system, 9'-11' of chimney should be a piece of cake.

 

I don't think my meter is off, I did the palm test and that was close to the 30% reading. Actually, the 1 meg ohm resister test would be more accurate than a palm test but I did the palm test anyway. I need to look and see if I can find a 1 meg or close in the parts bin. The thing is, everyone is just guessing here without data. If someone wants to foot the costs, then I will be happy to send you a sample of my wood for testing; you can keep the sample

Now, yes, someone might have excellent results with a four foot chimney with their stove and their environment. However, England Stove Works stated required 15 feet, England Stove Works did not just pull that number out of their arse; required was even in bold text meaning that it was not a suggestion. Furthermore, this stove is not a 30-NC; you can not compare the operation of a 30-NC to the Madison. Plus, I have been told that having the 90 stove pipe and the 90 tee is effectively reducing the height of my chimney even further; so for comparison, you need a 90 stove pipe and a 90 tee in your chimney configuration.

As for stove temperatures; while I wait for the thermometer that a member is sending me (and hugs to that member ) I took an old cooker oven thermometer and bent the stand out of the way and placed it flat on the stove in the area the manual stated. When the stove is running well; door shut and damper all the way open usually; medium load of wood, the temps can cruise around 475 (in Fs); and the house was a toasty 81 (in Fs). I am just afraid of over driving the stove until I get better thermos; I don't want to damage the stove.

 

I suspected I would have issues with the chimney before I installed the stove. I did a tissue paper test on the chimney and when the wind would blow, it would pull the tissue in but when the wind died, the tissue would fall back vertical. The reason I did not build it higher was because of money; or the lack of. Yes, I should have followed the requirements. What I do is start with a small fire that I can burn hot; door slightly ajar, to get the chimney heated without over-firing the stove. Then add larger pieces. Once the stove is up to temp and the chimney warm I can monitor it; usually damper all the way open, door shut with a small to medium load. I am having to babysit the stove when I shouldn't have to.

 

Would this seem to indicate that the typical consumer moisture meters are not that accurate? This would be an interesting project for a GTG; everyone with a different meters and same meters, test their meter on the same fresh split piece of wood and note the readings and record them. Compile the data and post the results to FHC.

 

Totally agree. While a shorter stack is indeed harder to get up to temp in warmer weather ( but it's not a race) compared to a taller stack, once the pipe is warm, it doesn't know it's short.

 

I've never delved into stack velocity or it's relationship to draft. I suppose (s.w.a.g.) all things equal, a 15 foot chimney would draft harder/have more velocity compared to a 10 foot chimney chimney, with the average inner temps the same.

Now what if the shorter stack has a higher temp, does a 600 F shorter chimney pull as hard or harder than a 500 F taller chimney?

Or if they both are 500 F 18" up, but the weather is severe, and the taller chimney loses more temp in the upper chimney? Thereby reducing the draft on the taller stack, due to a cooler overall column of air? I dunno. Food for thought?

I might also add temperature difference, as it's very noticeable on a shorter chimney.
Also not a chimney expert.

 

If you look at draft gauges (manometers) Dwyer makes a popular one (with wood burners) called the Mark II model 25, it is commonly marked in inches of water column (negative and positive pressures both) but is also comes in a version marked for velocity, as in feet per second.
From experience with using one on my wood furnace for a few years now I can say that when internal chimney temp goes up, the draft goes up, and vise versa too, draft goes up/temp goes up.
My Yukon furnace calls for -.03" WC draft (max) to be controlled by a barometric damper...they claim if the draft is controlled to their spec, the furnace and chimney can never be overfired.
What's my point...ah heck, I dunno, lost my train of thought here...maybe I'll remember later

 

Agreed. Occasionally, I light a fire when the outside temp is higher than the inside temp. Very sluggish draft, I have to crack the door but not too much or it will spill smoke. When the chimney gets up to temp it drafts fine.
I don't notice much difference in the draft vs outside temp (once the chimney is hot).
If the flue gas is 500F and the outside temp is 0F, delta T is 500F. If flue gas is 500F and 50F outside temp, delta T is 450F. ~10% difference.? Is the draft only 10% weaker?

 

I would have to disagree, it still knows it is short; it just does better while still knowing it is short.

 

Well, that is based on if the chimney can actually know its height; be it in centimeters or inches.

 

I think I've offered good thoughts on draft here, and in other posts. This is about what I'd expect from her in return.

We now return to your regular broadcast of I'm broke, begging without begging, maybe someone will buy me some chimney/install it/coddle me etc.

 

Like X 1000!

 

I think we can disagree here on this forum. But maybe we could keep it a little more civil?

Gary

 

If I understood correctly, you basically stated that a hot chimney draws better than a cold chimney even if that chimney is short. Yes, that is true. However, I was saying that a hot tall chimney will draw better than a hot short chimney.

 

I don't know much about class A chimneys. I remember years ago that it was stated that a masonry chimney connected to a fireplace should draw cold; I think it was at the time my sister was building a house with a fireplace. Now a fireplace has a venturi restriction and that might make a difference . I would think you would need a minimal draft with a cold chimney.