EPA stove: still can't make up my mind

Ok...I can't stand it.

This guy has just built a stove that allows him to control an over-fire situation, simply by closing down or shutting his secondary's AND more importantly he has the ability to totally snuff the primary air supply as well.

He now has the ability to put a fire out if need be. That is something that can't be done with modern EPA stoves, at least that I am aware of...at least not that I'm aware of.

If you look on craigslist long enough you will see plenty of tube stoves and CAT stoves that have been ruined by over-firing. To me, the problem can be solved simply by giving people back some of the control of their own stove. Why have they done this? I think it's to meet the EPA regulations mostly, and I understand that. However, I don't think many manufacturers expected to see the problems they've had...mainly because every "real world" scenario, stove set-up...location...chimney...the way a home breathes...they are all different...not to mention people simply not interested in properly learning how you use their stove. If it takes a little time to learn something different, then they don't have time for that. To some degree, more efficiency has back-fired on manufacturers because some folks are now afraid of modern stoves, which is sad.

I'm not afraid of them. I'm willing to take the time to learn how they function...it interests me...as does rocket stove technology. Some people just want a simple fire by simple means...set it and forget it. Some fail to realize that's what they now have if they'd take the time to learn a few quirks. I do think being able to shut down the primaries would offer a better sense of security for owners.

When a manufacture gives us back some control, like the last video above, that company will likely have one of the cleanest burning stoves ever while also being the safest. IMO!

 

Ha ha...I understand that crossbow thing.
I've told many an archer that said they'd never use one, that when the day comes, if you love to hunt and want to do it bad enough, you will resort to a crossbow. Hey, nothing wrong at all with that. Besides, the idea is an extremely old idea. I would like to see more people moving to archery and would like to see seasons separated. Used to an archer didn't have much competition in the woods...maybe some compound guys, but not nearly as many crossbow guys as there are these days. Same thing with primitive muzzleloader season...hardly any real primitive muzzleloader users these days. Sort of sad that they are put in competition with modern in-lines. I won't get into that argument here and now because I know how old the in-line design actually is, but they didn't used to be made with modern steels either...that's where the key difference is. Of course, then ol' Ned Roberts showed in his old, now antique book, what real distances the old guns were really capable of and it would surprise many. I just like the old ways. You might say I'm an old soul in a young body. By the way, your at least a couple decades older than me based on your wood burning experience. LOL!

 

I have to disagree with your statement here. My non-cat EPA stove doesn't need that maintenance so that is one less item I need to maintain/think about with my stove. I also save however much a new cat costs and don't need to shut the stove down to clean it.
There really isn't any maintenance on mine during burn season
besides dumping ash and cleaning the glass if I get the itch to.
Theoretically I really never have to shut mine down, push the coals to the side,
shovel out some ash and bank it back up.
I don't think you would want to do that with a catalyst, I'm sure you could
but it would be a little hot sticking your arms up in the beast.
I can't compare wood consumption but I really don't use a lot,
Last year was around 4 cords No more than 6 for sure. Most I've ever used though.
I don't honestly remember though and I ran my stove 24/7 pretty much.
I also tried teaching my girlfriend how to bank it and the minute there was coals, she would add a piece.
She still doesn't get it..

 

I'm pretty sure all CAT stoves have by-pass, but not 100% sure. I would think most, if not all, tube stoves have the same. Then again, I'm not 100% certain of that.

 

Unless I am missing some part of the conversation? This is how you clean out and reload a Cat stove as well. No different.

On the wood usage topic. I believe I use roughly 20+ percent less with my Cat stove due to the very long, even burn times. It has been significant. Not life or death! Mostly if you have access to all the wood you need and the time to process it.

I still love a good running tube stove also and would run one in a heart beat if a BK or Woodstock Cat stove was unavailable. No problem.

The girlfriend story above is hilarious! Good luck with her In the Pines..

 

Yes the context, discussing maintenance upkeep. specifically removing the catalyst to clean.

 

Why would you remove the catalyst to clean?

I may have figured out where you were heading. Possibly removing a Cat to clean it? Not a real common procedure unless you have ash plugging issues or the Cat is starting to fail. It is something to consider I guess.

 

moresnow, I can remove cat, clean it and re- install.. Reload stove and have heat in 20 minutes with stove top temps in 300s. Need gloves to remove stainless cat though..

 

Handy. Soooo, not much of a issue.
I vac mine while it is installed. Front face is easily accessible from the loading door. I vac the rear face after sliding my telescopic connector pipe up. And not all that often. Just to say its been done more or less! Its been a solid performer with zero additional cost in 3 years. Someday Ill have to replace it I am sure.

 

Interesting thread and a good read.


Welcome aboard Hoytman

 

Gang, I really do appreciate the warm welcome. Pun intended. Now, where's those emoticon's...oh...here they are...

 

Hey, I've never looked at that Sirrocco until now...that's a nice looking stove. Don't know why, but I only considered what the stove shop had in stock I guess...King, Princess and Ashford 30. I like the Ashford models real well. I'm thinking the 20 would likely suit me better with 1350 sq.ft. What say you? Should I consider the 30 models just for more punch when needed should I go with a BK stove?

I'm going to try and a narrow things down to a couple of stoves of each brand just in case I don't end up with the Lopi or Woodstock of my choice. That's probably the best way to approach this I suppose. Of course, I think I've already done this more than a few times. LOL! I've got a stack of brochures at least 3" thick. LOL!

The wife and I are making plans to take several weekend trips to different stove shops and try and look at as many brands as we can in person. Sort of one reason I threw the Buck name out there. Really impressed with how they are made...and heavy too.

 

Omg. The original post was like reading war and peace...

Good luck brother .. You will be just fine with an epa stove. Frankly given the square footage you will likely be too warm.

Lots of good suggestions here. Just a note ... The NC30 is closer to a Myriad than an ht2000. I'd go with the ht2000 btw.

 

Unfortunately this is the case for many many things in life. How many of you drive a manual transmission vehicle? Better control, better mileage, more reliable, and way more rewarding than any automatic ... But they a getting very hard to find because no one buys them.

It's not just regulations... If you are a manufacturer you try engineer out ways customers can mis-use your products.

 

Ah yes. The stove hunt! You have sooo many options to choose from. Most are capable of providing everything you need. Do you want a reasonably priced tube stove? Drolet or Englander. Better looking tube stove? Jotul or PE perhaps. Likely many others in the tube department that may fit.
Or do you want superb fire control with unbeatable burn times and very controllable even heat output. If you choose the latter option I would recommend Blaze King and Woodstock.

As far as BK goes I'd look at the 30 box options, Princess or the newly introduced Boxer 24 for your home size. Just a heads up on BK stuff. My 20 size stove does 12-15hrs on a load day in and day out until it gets bucky cold. Zero F and lower with wind may get down to 8-9-10 hr loads on my small 20 box. My home has very poor insulation also. My longest burns/restarts without kindling or starter materials have exceeded 20 hrs during shoulder season. I normally do 12 hr reloads for convenience as much of the load is used up and I have excellent coals to start the new load. The 30 box units can stretch out much longer easily. Advertised BK burn times are realistic. However, it really depends on how well your structure retains heat. If its leaky you run the stove harder and there goes the burn times! BK has excellent support available if you have questions your local dealer doesn't satisfy.

Woodstock..... I wish I had a spot to put one! I have nothing but goodness to say about this shop. I spoke/emailed/PM'd at length with them prior to committing to BK. The clearance to combustibles on there stove options just didn't work where I needed to set my stove (my room is to small). These stoves are truly respected widely as top performers. I prefer a simple welded steel stove compared to soapstone due to potential future maintenance issues only. Otherwise the Soapstone options are sweet. Someday I will have a Fireview just because. Look at the Absolute steel or Ideal Steel. They are priced reasonably. They have great feedback. Ask or post a inquiry perhaps on any of the brands discussed before purchasing. Its good reading for all of us!

You can likely tell I am a Cat stove guy at heart. Ive had the EPA non cats and have had several in my group of fellow burners. We all use Cat stoves now to take advantage of the burn times, even heat, reduced wood consumption. No offense to any tube stove guys its just been my experience!

 

Myriad? Not familiar with that one.
That HT2000 has a huge firebox, but I'm not too hip on it's looks. Some black paint could take care of that though. With my room only being 12'-14' wide and 32' long...not counting the kitchen...I'm afraid a stove that large will cook me out of the house even on low. At least that's the way the old stove was in the house...much to big. It was a beautiful old "Buck" style stove built by my uncle for my grandparents. Before we knew we was going to buy the house I allowed my 1st cousin to take it with him since his dad built it and it was our grandparents...a move I regret in a way...but I am very happy it is still in the family.

The stove I have now is roughly the same size and I haven't burned it since we moved it 1 1/2 yrs. ago. I did burning while I was working in the house remodeling some, but the stove needed some work that is currently being done now. New steel plates where the glass went. Not paying nearly $400 for glass when the stove isn't worth that much to me. I'm having the plates cut down so I can wrap them with window gasket material, which never was in place. The stove leaked smoke pretty bad. When I took the doors off what little gasket material was there just disintegrated. The stove is a 2 door stove and had a 3/4" flat gasket where a 3/8" round gasket was supposed to be. I have that all ready for replacement now. I also am having a 1/4" thick backing plate built to hold the window plates in place and to protect the gasket material around the plates. By the time I get that finished in a few days and get the door gasketing in place I should be ready to go. I'm glad...dang fuel oil is killing my wallet.

Yeah, potential future maintenance is a something I look at too. Though it may not be that big of a deal to do, and might actually allow a good thorough inspection of the stove, maybe. That's sort of why I was leaning towards a steel stove myself and having some real thick soapstone plates cut to place on top of it when I want to.

I like the customization of the IS, but it a lot of ways it looks "hard" to me...the lines are too hard. Guess you can't have it all.

The reality for me is though, and I've already told y'all how my luck is, about the time I buy a stove some manufacturer will come out with everything I'm looking for in a stove. That's just how it usually goes with me.

 

Hoytman, where in South West Ohio do you live? I live an hour East of Cincinnati. I have a Woodstock Progress Hybrid and a Pacific Energy T6. Your welcome to come over and check out the build quality and operation. I’ll smoke something on the smoker and we can talk stoves. PM me for my number and we can iron out the details if you want to head over

 

It's kind of a personal taste thing I guess.

When I was shopping for a new stove, the hard lines of the IS attracted my attention.

Most important however was reading a lot on the long burn times and efficiency of the stove.

My finalists we're BK, WS, NC30

Since all three seemed fairly equal in burn time and efficiency, the IS won due to the lines, the soapstone, and the customization factor.

I don't regret the purchase at all.


Wish you luck in your search.