460 for sale but is 38 inch bar required?

Barcroftb · Apr 20, 2017

Boomstick said: ↑

I don't see his post that way at all.
He's just calling it how he sees it.

You can calculate rotational mass vs hp loss. But as far as friction on a bar and chain I'm at a loss.

I think cobbling together a dyno with different chain lengths would be a good test (better than videos cutting too many varriables and in my opinion silly.) would tell the story.
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We'll have to agree to disagree. I now have content from this derailed thread on ignore. FatBoy85 my apologies for my part in the thread derail.

Screwloose · Apr 20, 2017

Canadian border VT said: ↑

Screwloose.. I do not want to speak for you.. your math is right.. I think the difference here comes from a matter of perspective.. some are talking about racing, cutting cookies or cants.. where your original * of minimal increase in friction matters... when winning or losing is measured in hundredths of a second..

where you may be discussing cutting firewood.. my own limited experience in cutting firewood is you are right. we often block logs with a 462 if tree is an average 18 plus inch at but and get I grab a 25 bar instead of 20.. I always seen to get one notch that is too big.. it seems to cut faster when nose is out a bit.. certainly not any slower.. I got no experience cutting cants or cookies.. I assume the number of rakers actually cutting on same type of chain with different bar lengths would be same.. meaning if cutting a 18 in tree only 8 or 9 rakers are cutting on down stroke at any one time.. the longer bar may have more but they are not touching wood thereby adding friction once they clear tree and go around and re engage the wood
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What got me started was the comment before mine about a buddy's saw cutting really fast with a shorter bar. I was trying to help the OP by supplying information on the actual effect of a longer bar on performance in his application. A lot of people actually do believe that the saw is somehow transformed into a speed demon with a shorter bar.
I'm sorry. I thought that this was all dead awhile ago. I concede.

FatBoy85 · Apr 20, 2017

damm where have I been? This was a bigger debate than I thought. I think my general thinking on this was not wanting to overload the saw. Trade length(shorten it) for power. Length is only in my mind just easier to cut without digging in the round that is longer than the bar existing(term missing here). Don't worry about the debate. Just use your wood to heat yourselves not your head...

DexterDay · Apr 20, 2017

Screwloose said: ↑

I guess what I'm bothered with is that I even put a asterisk in my first reply stating that friction would slightly increase. So many times I'm told that a shorter bar and chain "goes" (for lack of a better word) "faster" than a long one. This is untrue. Now for cutting cookies with one down the next up and the third down the manipulation of extra bar length with increased weight will be detrimental. But in a single downward cut with the saw held in a fixture counterbalanced to keep the same cutting force on the tangent of the log changing bar lengths has little effect.
Just not that much friction in the chain in the groove. The rotational mass actually helps (think flywheel). And the weight means nothing in what I was saying.
I've also run a chainsaw mill and we experimented with different bar lengths (excess sticking out the side) with the longer bar cutting faster. Counter to what you'd think.
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I can agree with that. If it were racing though, the 60" bar would hinder you. Greatly... I see the point in the rotational mass and each cutter gets less work (sharper longer). I'll exit and see your side on the milling side of things.

Khntr85 · Apr 21, 2017

Awesome another reason I like this site, we may disagree, but all is well that ends well boys.....thank goodness this is over.....cheers!!

MasterMech · Apr 22, 2017

You can argue the academics of bar and chain effects on cut speed until the cows come home. And maybe unless you are indeed cant racing, there are far bigger reasons that go with a longer/shorter bar on a given powerhead than a tenth or two on the stopwatch. Theoretically, skip chain should cut just as fast as full comp in the same wood on the same powerhead. So why is that not always the case? (Not actually asking for a debate here, just pointing out that these effects are far more complicated to explain than a simple it is, or it isn't.)

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460 for sale but is 38 inch bar required?

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