In loving memory of Kenis D. Keathley 6/4/81 - 3/27/22 Loving father, husband, brother, friend and firewood hoarder Rest in peace, Dexterday

Splitter pump upgrade.

Discussion in 'Chainsaws and Power Equipment' started by bobdog2o02, May 18, 2016.

  1. tractorman44

    tractorman44

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    I thinking that the majority of hydraulic pumps are to be turned clockwise as viewed from the shaft end....could be entirely wrong on that one. But look and see if the shaft is slightly offset from dead center, if so thats the primary gear that pressurizes oil passing between its teeth and the pump housing on one side and at the same time turns the driven gear to pressurize the oil between the teeth of the gear and the inner surface of the pump housing on the opposing side of the pump. So turning the shaft by hand you can visualize whats happening internally to move oil from the inlet to the outlet.

    Most high capacity pumps have larger suction ports and smaller outlet ports...and if you have dual inlets (or a pump with three unmarked ports) you can just about be positive the two on one side are both suction ports which allow the pump to be used in either direction. Kinda like that cute girl you dated in high school...and you later found out she went either way. ...well, maybe not like that at all, but we needed a little levity here.....

    Some of these smaller capacity two stage pumps probably have or at least could have the same size inlets and outlets. And most should be either tagged when bought new or possibly marked in the casting if you're lucky.

    Oh...and I too am not an engineer nor do I play one on TV. I'm just a plain old country boy with a tractor, a couple chainsaws and a welder.....and I enjoy using all of them...albeit not too good (by professional standards anyway).

    Oh, and you guys are killin' me with the cranium drainium. Funny stuff man.
     
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  2. JustWood

    JustWood Guest

    Tank size may become an issue with too big of a pump.
    Heat and cavitation.
    I just bought a pump for a Rolloff truck from precisionfluidpower.com. These guys were the bomb and i had my pump less than 36 hrs after ordering. :thumbs:
    There's a request quote feature on their site where you can enter your pump part # and request a larger GPM and they will match up a bigger GPM with the same physical dimensions/bolt pattern/shaft size of your current pump.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016
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  3. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    Two-stage hyd pumps are actually two pumps in one. I've not seen one yet that works by choking down the outlet of a larger pump to make it act like a smaller pump. That could be quite dangerous actually unless there is a pressure relief circuit ahead of this valve and even then it would create a lot of excess heat in the fluid.

    Two-stage pumps are two pumps bolted together and the combined output of both pumps is used to create a high-volume/low-pressure output that moves the ram quickly but with less force. One of the pumps in the pump assembly will have an "unloader valve" which is similar to a pressure relief valve. It is set to operate at a much lower pressure than the system maximum however. Once the ram encounters resistance (a log in this case) this valve will open and short-circuit the output of the pump back to it's inlet. This effectively shuts the pump off and makes all of the engines power available to drive the other pump until either the log splits or the system pressure reaches its relief setting. Once the system pressure falls back below the unloader valve's threshold, it will allow the second pump to resume normal operation and increase the ram speed.

    This is exactly like driving your car/pickup and approaching a steep hill. Once the engine begins to labor, you downshift the transmission to climb the hill, and upshift to resume normal speed once you reach flatter ground or start back down the other side.

    A 13 gpm pump should work well on that splitter. It looks like the hyd tank is built into the cross axle assembly. If that's not the case, could we get a couple pics that show the whole unit? SquareFile mentioned the size of the hoses, hardlines, and fittings which will play a role. Too small and the higher gpm pump will have to work harder wasting fuel and generating excess heat in the fluid. But with a modestly sized pump (11-13gpm), I wouldn't worry unless the lines are all under 1/2" in size.
     
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  4. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Cranium geranium?

    upload_2016-5-21_9-43-29.jpeg
     
  5. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Raining pretty hard here now. Going to get at some pics later. Im really digging all of the helpfull input.
     
  6. Eric VW

    Eric VW Moderator

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    :rofl: :lol::thumbs:
    Cranium geranium drainium, oh my!
     
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  7. tractorman44

    tractorman44

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    Great explanation....here I stand, as said before, bowing with hat in hand. Thats a much better and exacting description of what happens inside the two stage pump than the less than technical and rudimentary description I was given many years ago as a lay person talking to a pump salesman. I will commit this to memory as the 'go to' information for the internal operation when the need arises again. This certainly makes a whole lot more sense. Again, awesome description.

    Admittedly, I am not a slow mechanic nor am I a fast mechanic...BUT however, I AM a half-fast mechanic. Now repeat the last portion quickly.....
     
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  8. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    :rofl: :lol::rofl: :lol::rofl: :lol::rofl: :lol::rofl: :lol::rofl: :lol:

    Should I ever need a new username I know exactly what I'm gonna use. :dex: :handshake:
     
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  9. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Sorry for the delay guys here are the pics.....

    It looks like the rotation is clockwise per the recoil direction.

    The crank looks like .75" with a .25" key way.

    The pump looks like a .50" shaft with a .0125" keyway.

    Bolt spacing hole to hole on the motor is about 2.5" and on the pump side of the bracket is 2.0"

    Am I on track with this stuff?
    20160531_172107.jpg 20160531_172124.jpg 20160531_172203.jpg 20160531_172226.jpg 20160531_172303.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2016
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  10. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    I think ill be going with This Kit. My only hang up is how to get the coupler off of the engine. Its pretty stuck. 3-Jaw?
     
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  11. RCBS

    RCBS

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    Measurements all look good to me. .0125 = 1/8.

    I'd say you are barking up the right tree with the kit.

    3 jaw should work fine. Do those couplers have a rubber dampener?
     
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  12. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Mine doesnt.... the kit has a knock off love joy.
     
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  13. Eric VW

    Eric VW Moderator

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    Plenty of Liquid Wrench/Kroil/PB Blaster......
    We're looking at progress now, boys!
    :thumbs:
     
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  14. Barcroftb

    Barcroftb

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    I'll second the Kroil!
     
  15. Horkn

    Horkn

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    Kroil is the absolute best stuff there is.

    Now I see the kit you want to get, fits the Hondas and chonda. With your Briggs being an 'Merican motor, you'll have to verify it will work.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2016
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  16. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Bolt spacing measures out right.
     
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  17. Horkn

    Horkn

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    That's what matters.
     
  18. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    Bearing separator behind the coupling and use a steering wheel type puller to yank it off.
     
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  19. bobdog2o02

    bobdog2o02

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    Bearing seperator? That's new to me.
     
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  20. Eric VW

    Eric VW Moderator

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    Separates bearings, bud.....
    :whistle:
    :rofl: :lol:
    :faint:
    :picard: