In loving memory of Kenis D. Keathley 6/4/81 - 3/27/22 Loving father, husband, brother, friend and firewood hoarder Rest in peace, Dexterday

Echo CS-590 Problem

Discussion in 'Chainsaws and Power Equipment' started by Daeven, Apr 20, 2021.

  1. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    I have a new Echo CS-590 that has only had a couple of tanks of fuel used on it. I purchased it earlier this year and it was having issues pretty much right away. It will start and run very well at first, but after running for 5 minutes or so, it will stall out under load and is then very difficult to restart. Once restarted, it runs well for another minute and then will stall out under load again. When it starts stalling, no reduction of load or throttle change seems to stop the stall, so I assume it is having a fueling issue. Has anyone solved a similar problem, and what did it need?

    I did buy it from an ACE Hardware dealer and assumed they did service just like the other ACE Hardware that sold me a Stihl. Apparently I was wrong, so I would have to take it to an authorized service location. I rebuild V4 motorcycle carburetors for fun, so I'm not afraid to take it apart and work on it myself, but it would be nice to hear about others' experience with similar issues.
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2021
    tamarack, Screwloose, Loon and 6 others like this.
  2. Jeremy Anthon

    Jeremy Anthon

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2021
    Messages:
    83
    Likes Received:
    701
    Location:
    Baton Rouge, Louisiana
    I have a 590, only a month or so old and haven't had any of these issues but I'm curious what is causing the problem for you. Hope you get some answers.
     
  3. Nixon

    Nixon

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Messages:
    669
    Likes Received:
    3,009
    Location:
    West Sunbury,Pa .
    Seems like you have a wonky carb . It could also not have been set up properly . The CS 590 has a walbro 268a carb ,and itsets up a bit differently than most other carbs ,as you can see in the following print out from the shop manual .
    Personally , being as it’s that new , I’d let a dealer handle it .

    5. With 2.5 mm blade screwdriver, turn L and H mixture needles clockwise until lightly seated (Fig.4), then turn out both mixture needles follow- ing turns.
    L mixture needle : 2, H mixture needle : 3/4
    NOTE: If needles are forced during seating, dam- age to carburetor may occur.
    6. Remove air cleaner lid and air filter to expose idle adjust screw and throttle plate. Turn idle adjust screw counterclockwise and set the screw until the tip just contacts the throttle plate. Then turn idle adjust screw 2 3/8 turns clockwise. Reinstall air fil- ter, and cleaner lid.
    NOTE: The initial carburetor settings for idle adjust screw, L and H mixture needles are intended to start and run engine before final carburetor ad- justments are made through this procedure. The actual number of turns needed for engine opera- tion may vary.
    Start and warm engine for 1 minute alternating engine speed between WOT and idle every 5 seconds. Turn H mixture needle counterclockwise until engine speed drops to approx. 11,500 rpm at WOT.
    NOTE: Do not run engine at high speed without load longer than 10 seconds, or engine damage may occur.
    2. Adjust L mixture needle using 2.5 mm blade screwdriver to reach maximum engine rpm just before lean rpm drop off.
    3. Set idle speed to 3,600 rpm by turning idle adjust screw. Engine rpm should be stable at 3,600 +/- 50 rpm after idle adjust screw adjustment.
    H mixture needle
    L mixture needle
    4. Turn L mixture needle counterclockwise reducing idle speed 800 rpm to set idle speed at 2,800 rpm. The idle speed range is 2,700 - 2,900 rpm.
    NOTE: Engine speed must be allowed to stabilize a minimum of 20 seconds after each adjustment of L mixture needle to assure accurate tachometer readings.
    5. Before adjustment, WOT engine speed should be 11,500 rpm or less. If rpm is higher, turn H mixture needle counterclockwise until 11,500 rpm is achieved. To make the final WOT engine speed adjustment, turn H mixture needle clockwise in 1/8 turn increments with the engine at idle. After each adjustment, ac- celerate to WOT, and check rpm. The final rpm should fall within 12,100 - 12,500 rpm at WOT.
    NOTE: When H mixture needle is turned completely clockwise, the engine will continue to run. If engine speed at WOT is above 13,300 rpm, adjust H mixture needle counterclockwise and set maximum engine speed at less than 13,000 rpm.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2021
    Fifelaker, Screwloose, Loon and 8 others like this.
  4. Chud

    Chud

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2020
    Messages:
    5,733
    Likes Received:
    39,296
    Location:
    NC
    I agree that you should have authorized service dealer sort it out while saw is under warranty.
     
  5. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    It turns out Echo reports the place I bought it from as a "servicing dealer," and that's where I found them. They got rid of their mechanic and no longer provide service. The closest actual servicing dealer is 4 weeks out for repairs, but would be happy to take care of it.
     
  6. Chud

    Chud

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2020
    Messages:
    5,733
    Likes Received:
    39,296
    Location:
    NC
    That’s no good. I would still contact echo in case it’s something serious. A new saw shouldn’t have mechanical issues.
     
  7. Nixon

    Nixon

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Messages:
    669
    Likes Received:
    3,009
    Location:
    West Sunbury,Pa .
    Daeven , Sorry for your troubles with this saw . I’d also do as Chud said . But , I’d also take the saw to the servicing dealer . That 4 week wait won’t get shorter this time of year .
    Good luck with this . I really hate reading these sort of posts ,and always wish the OP was closer so that I could see the saw .
     
  8. M2theB

    M2theB

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2017
    Messages:
    2,990
    Likes Received:
    19,092
    Location:
    Central Massachusetts
    i had a similar issue with a Husqvarna 572. Less than 10 tanks through it.

    it turned out to be a fouled metering valve screen. Not sure how it got crudded up so fast but I haven’t ruled out chit in the tank or lines or even the carb, coming from the factory.
    I pretty careful with the fuel I use, and no other saws using the same tank can have had the issue.
    This 572 had the issue since tank 2 and just got worse until it was not runnable.
    Cleaned the carb and it runs great.
    Here’s what I found when I finally opened it.

    1FE74E49-A11B-45B5-849B-6252F6E0C3A2.jpeg
     
  9. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    I dragged the saw in to my local servicing dealer and just heard back from them today. Unfortunately he said it needs a new top end. They will contact Echo for warranty repair/replacement, but I got the feeling he wasn't sure that Echo will cover it. I'll report back when I get news, but that doesn't leave me very happy with my Echo purchase. I used the same premium mixed fuel in a bunch of 2-strole stuff, including the Stihl MS161, an Echo and Stihl backpack blowers, various trimmers and edgers. This chainsaw lasted less than an hour of use before acting up, and I've never destroyed a 2-stroke device before - well, except for the Walmart 12" chainsaw that I abused occasionally for 30 years, and I'm pretty sure a carb clean and new fuel lines will get that thing running again.
     
  10. Biddleman

    Biddleman

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2019
    Messages:
    2,544
    Likes Received:
    19,262
    Location:
    River Hills of Pennsylvania
    I have a 590 and have run it hard. Can't imagine if you were running the proper fuel that the top end would be fouled in an hour. Sounds like a defect. Hopefully echo will make it right.
     
    Screwloose, Loon, brenndatomu and 2 others like this.
  11. Mag Craft

    Mag Craft

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2014
    Messages:
    4,802
    Likes Received:
    27,717
    Location:
    South East Wyoming
    I hope the mechanic working on it finds out why the top end got destroyed so that a repeat performance does not happen again.

    Things like cranks seals causing lean condition or the carb malfunction causing a lean condition. Anything causing an air leak and then a lean condition would have destroyed the top end.
     
  12. huskihl

    huskihl

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2016
    Messages:
    3,519
    Likes Received:
    19,676
    Location:
    Michigan
    Probably tuned too lean from the factory. Defeat the carb limiters so you can tune it correctly and mod the muffler so you can hear when it’s not running right
     
    Screwloose, Fifelaker, Loon and 3 others like this.
  13. Jeremy Anthon

    Jeremy Anthon

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2021
    Messages:
    83
    Likes Received:
    701
    Location:
    Baton Rouge, Louisiana
    Yeah definitely a defective unit. I got a 590 and I run it hard with no issues. If they don't cover it under warranty then post your story on social media and tag Echo's Twitter and Instagram accounts. If you embarrass them a bit on social media it will probably get you taken care of.
     
  14. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    Warranty request denied. I just reached out to Echo on their Facebook page to see if they would like to talk with me, or if I should share my experience elsewhere (besides here). I might have to re-signup to Twitter.
     
    Screwloose and Loon like this.
  15. Chud

    Chud

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2020
    Messages:
    5,733
    Likes Received:
    39,296
    Location:
    NC
    That sucks. What was the reason for the denial?
     
    Screwloose, Nixon and Loon like this.
  16. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    They assume it was run without 2-stroke oil after the dealer reported significant scoring on the piston and bore. Unless it happened before I bought it, that didn't occur from no oil. My straight fuel is in a 5 gallon container used to fill up the small 2-stoke gas container. That 2-stoke gas is used on everything I own except the riding mower - Stihl MS162, Echo backpack blower, Echo string trimmer, Echo edger, Husky backpack blower. Everything else has been filled up and run on the same fuel, and I have no other problems. I've been using 2-stroke stuff for 30 years and this is the first time I've had such a failure.

    After it started acting up, I checked the fuel to make sure it looked mixed and it did. Obviously I have no way to check it was the exact mixture, but I always use the same small oil container that is the right measure for my 1 gallon gas can.

    It is interesting that the saw did not come in a box and had no manual. It certainly was clean enough to pass for brand new and I did buy from an Echo authorized dealer, but I didn't disassemble it looking for saw dust.
     
    Screwloose, Loon, Ohio and 1 other person like this.
  17. Stephiedoll

    Stephiedoll

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2013
    Messages:
    3,541
    Likes Received:
    24,655
    Location:
    Omaha, NE.
    Can't like this. I hope you can get some satisfaction from Echo Daeven
     
    Screwloose, Nixon and Loon like this.
  18. Nixon

    Nixon

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    Messages:
    669
    Likes Received:
    3,009
    Location:
    West Sunbury,Pa .
    Sorry to read this . Did you see the piston ? Generally a straight gas will have scoring on the intake side as well as the exhaust .Hopefully ,you can get in touch with someone upstream from the dealership .
     
    Screwloose, Mag Craft and brenndatomu like this.
  19. Daeven

    Daeven

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2021
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    119
    Location:
    Georgia
    So obviously I'm a little disappointed in my Echo, but now I'm more disappointed in this dealer. Remember, I bought this thing from a dealer that the Echo website indicated was a servicing dealer. I then found out they no longer do service, and I've now pointed that out to Echo (maybe they will update their site).

    I took the saw to the next closest dealer for the service and warranty claim. They took $40 and 5 weeks to remove the muffler and see scoring on the piston. They claim they did a leak-down test too. When they called me first, the guy told me he would submit the warranty claim to Echo and get back to me. I heard back a few days later "sorry, warranty claim denied." Today I reached out to Echo to ask for follow-up on the denied claim. They have no record of hearing about my saw.

    My wife picked the saw up for me today and chatted with the guy for a bit. She mentioned all the other 2-stroke devices we have, and years of experience using them. The mechanic said "I've been doing this for 30 years and knew they wouldn't replace it under warranty, so I didn't submit it." He also suggested this kind of damage can happen when you use Stihl oil in an Echo saw. She didn't know what kind of oil I use, so she left it at that. It turns out I use Echo Power Blend X in everything, and that's what the downloaded CS-590 manual suggests. All my web searching since then suggests he was talking out of the wrong orifice, but then again, I've never seen Stihl oil.

    They didn't even bother to put it back together. It looks like only the muffler was removed so nobody looked at the intake side. I'll reach out to Echo again to see if they want me to take it somewhere else, or if I can just disassemble it myself to see the intake side. I must say that Echo was awesome on the phone and I'm hopeful they will still help me out. If I don't get anywhere with this, a piston/cylinder kit on eBay goes for $175.

    All this just reinforces what I've read here - find a good servicing dealership and just buy what they carry. The place that sold me the little Stihl seemed great (although I've never needed service there). Buying a second saw from the same place may have put me in a better position. Does anyone have good dealer experiences NE of Atlanta?

    Picture of exhaust side of piston is attached. That thing is toast.
     

    Attached Files:

  20. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

    Joined:
    May 29, 2015
    Messages:
    20,848
    Likes Received:
    130,441
    Location:
    NE Ohio
    100% steaming pile of BS right there...