Anyone with a Quadrafire 5700?

Hey all! New guy here. I’ve tried looking for threads specific to the Quadrafire 5700 step top wood stove but couldn’t find anything, so if this has already been covered somewhere then I apologize for a duplicate post.

I currently have a Harman coal stove (came with the house) which I’ve used to burn wood from time to time and it’s wildly inefficient for any long term burns, shocker right?! We had some land timbered a couple years back so I’ve been scrounging as much firewood as possible and would now like to add an actual wood burning stove to the house. I’m not really up on the cats or tubes except for what I’ve read on here and from manufacturers. So this is my current dilemma and I’m hoping someone can provide me with some real life usage details.

I’m looking for a stove that can provide me with some long burn times, 2 days a week nobody is home for at least 10 hours during the day and would like the fire to still be going strong when someone does get home. I live in central PA so we can experience some pretty cold days and nights which would require pumping out heat but they aren’t all that common anymore and I will be keeping the coal stove. So, my first thought was to get a cat stove but the kicker is, I’m able to get a new Quadrafire 5700 for almost half off.

Does anybody here own one? Could you please give me any kind of real life experience with it? Burn time, break downs, quirks, good, bad and ugly?

Am I wrong for thinking the 5700 is the better choice over a cat stove? We’re talking a savings of probably $3,500+ compared to a BK Princess which was probably my first choice of cat stoves.

Thank you for any and all input as I truly am completely green to the modern EPA stoves.

 

Go with the Princess. Not because it’s a CAT stove, but because of the thermostat.

Black Rock burner here that’s spent near a decade looking at and researching different wood burning stoves. Currently using a Hitzer 354 burning nut coal for 4th season.

If you must…check out the big Regency 5200 hybrid stove. They say 30hr burn times with it.
F5200 Hybrid Catalytic Wood Stove | Modern Wood Stoves by Regency

If I were you, I’d start weighing my coal usage per day for the season. Using the anthracite btu rate/lb figure if 12,500btu/lb you can get reappy close to your btu/hr needs.

Once you determine daily btu average use, and for the season, as well as pounds of coal used you’ll have some real world numbers to work with.

The next step would be to compare stove weight and actual square inches of stove body real estate and compare with your Harmon coal stove.

Just keep in mind that the Harmon doesn’t have a thermostat so you’ll be somewhat able to compare wood stoves without a thermostat, BUT a thermostat on a coal stove…on that Harmon will make it more efficient if you were to add one. I mention this because once you have a thermostat you won’t want to be without one even on a wood stove.

Consistent bi-metal regulators simply make for more consistency in heat output and far less temperature fluctuation inside the home. You can get the same thing with your Harmon, you just have to be precise on resetting your air controls after tending. Those Harmons are well built…some of the heaviest built. I agree with keeping it.

I’m not a big fan of Quadrafire choice of firebricks as they don’t hope up. However, bricks are generally cheap.

I like to compare Quadrafire with Lopi and Regency similarly sized models and compare number of parts and moving parts. Less of both is a plus to me. Other than that I’ve not seen too many complaints about the Quad.

I do like the fact that the Lopi, Quad, Buck, Hitzer, Harmon, Keystoker, D.S. Stoves, all have a similar design to allow convection air without the use of a blower when power is out. Be mindful that at least one of these (I think Quad, but not sure) are similarly designed (convection air out the top) but the manual may require the blower use at all times. I forget which it is, and it may not be any of them…which would be a good thing when power goes out. I wouldn’t own a stove without it really. Come to think of it, Blaze King kay also require blowers to be on at all times. I’m sure some BK user can confirm or deny this for us.

EDIT:
I believe the D.S. Stoves (Comfortmax 75, Emergymax ND110/160) are the only secondary air tube stoves that utilize a bi-metal regulator (thermostat) that I’m aware of, except for possibly Vermont Castings…and they may all be hybrid stoves now, I’m not sure.

 

A coal stove usually burns more than ten hours once up and running.What's happening with yours ?

 

Hoytman, thank you for all the information and insight, it seems like you have a lot of it and it’s very much appreciated. I’ll look into that Regency as well, my only question with that is cost and if it’s comparable to a BK then is it really worth the extra money? If I were having to pay full price for the Quad then it wouldn’t be much of a decision and I’d go with the BK Princess or a similar stove. Being able to pickup a Quad 5700 for around $1,600 is the biggest selling point for me right now.

I agree a thermostat would be ideal as well but, from what I’ve read, the Quads have their own temperature control with the ACC system. This is one of the things I’m hoping to get a little more input on and how well it works or doesn’t work. Also, from what I’ve read they do not require a blower to operate.

 

Rich, nothing is wrong with mine. Coal just costs money, it’s dirtier, makes more ash and harder for the lady friend to tend if I’m not home. For us personally, it’s also not the greatest for shoulder months or these random 60-70 degree days in November. I don’t want to get rid of it as I do love having it when the cold really starts to bite but I also want the option of a proper wood stove. To have more precise control of the heat output and the ease of starting/tending wood fires is an asset to us. I also have access to more wood than I’ll ever be able to cut and split before it goes bad and it doesn’t “cost” me anything. Yes the fuel, oil, chains, upkeep and time are all costs but for someone like myself who can’t sit still, cutting firewood is a type of therapy over the winter months for me.

 

Have you bought it yet?! Nothing wrong with the 5700 (except maybe the early models, but that was a long time ago) go get it.
Thats a big stove, do you need that kind of output?

 

Good post. Great question.


That’s why I gave the information I did. That’s indeed an outstanding price (if it’s not a model they had trouble with…research it and be sure), but does he need that much more additional heat?

That’s the big question for him.
I know that my 354 is giant for my house, so super low and steady as she goes. I run it far lower than Hitzer recommends and the Hitzer owner (Dean Lehman) has been quite impressed with the super low numbers I shared with him.

If I even attempt to burn wood in it, it can easily overheat my house…even with lack luster door intake spinners when trying to get a clean burn…which is impossible with anything but a full tilt burn since my stove doesn’t have reburn tubes or a catalyst to burn smoke…so a hot fire is the only way to burn clean and it’s simply far too much heat. With wood my stove is big enough to heat 3000 sq ft…over double the space that we have.

If he has a Harmon III coal stove (now Legacy Stoves) and he runs it in the 500F-650F range ALL the time, then he might need the big Quad or Regency stove. If he’s not running the coal stove that hard, then unless he wants to buy the Quad to resell, then either of those big wood stoves would be serious overkill in my estimation unless I’ve missed some details. Those stoves are a lot of real estate that even on low burn isn’t even close to the low steady burn rate the coal stove can provide. The only wood stove capable of matching how a coal stove runs is the Blaze King, period.

I would research the Quad and see what year it was made, make sure it wasn’t a problem stove, then jump on it. He can’t really lose at that price. He might end up deciding it’s too big and be disappointed, but he can’t lose. You don’t know unless you try, but I’m betting it’ll throw too much heat even on a steady low burn. He can make it work by letting the house temperature swing more, but that’s a decision he needs to make and accept.

Make sure all wood is cut, split, stacked off of ground, and top covered 2 year’s minimum and preferably 3 years.

I’m still putting my money on the Princess or another smaller wood stove as a better fit.

See, he’s in the same boat I was in. Faced with a nice stove at a more than reasonable price. My stove being a coal stove, knowing it can be run at a lower rate than a wood stove AND having a thermostat, made my decision easy.

Then I found a Lopi Liberty…nearly identical in size to my coal stove…about <$1200 less than the Quad he’s buying. I bought it to try in the house. Once I tried wood in my 354 I automatically knew the big Liberty was far too much wood stove for my house. So, it may be for sale at some point unless I put it in my shop later. The 354 and Liberty are close in size, but the Liberty with secondary air tubes, even on low with wood, still needs to burn too hot to keep the secondaries firing…and they fire around 1200F I believe. Someone correct me if I’m wrong. That’s a tremendous amount of heat being thrown off the top of the Liberty even on low burn…and remember that low burn is now where close to as low as the coal stove will idle, far from it.

Here’s another example of the difference in stove size needed when comparing a coal stove with when burning wood in that sale coal stove, or another wood stove:

Even burning coal in my 354 stove burning it at 425 (measurer front of stove) I can place my hand on my stove pipe and leave it there. I cannot do that when burning wood in the same stove, the pipe simply gets far too hot.

That showcases not only how much heat is lost up the stack burning wood than when burning coal in my stove, but it’s a testament to how the heat is transferred differently into the room from the stove as well. It’s all about air flow within the stove, wood burning from the outside in, and coal burning from the bottom up. As so many anthracite black rock burners say about burn coal…”forget everything you know about burning wood because burning anthracite is totally different”. It’s an entirely new learning curve.

For that price you can’t lose buying and trying the Quadrfire stove. I’d be leery of my wife loading up that much wood and leaving the house simply because she’s not into stoves like me and my son. So a thermostat makes things easy…and also safer by design since a bi-metal regulator (thermostat) won’t allow a stove to over fire and run away. Something else to consider and has been problems in several brands of secondary air tube stoves. Most often the issue is loading full and letting the stove get too hot before turning it down…not accounting for the delay between real internal temperatures and those temperatures shown on stove top thermometers.

Not trying to overload the OP with information, but not wanting to leave anything out to help them make an informed decision.

The wrong stove at the right price is still the wrong stove…except you can sell it for more than you paid to help pay for the right stove…which you’ll find by trial and error as well as by using the btu comparisons and stove size comparisons I talked about in my first post.

I hope all this is helpful in some way. Don’t forget to tell us what you decide to do and how it worked out in the long run. Also, let me know if my suggestions were spot on or especially far off.

 

Remember on these odd warm days you can always employ the use of “windowstats”. Trust me, you won’t be wasting that much coal. We do it all the time, but there are times that this stove too big that I have is still throwing far too much heat even at 170F stove temp…just too many square inches of stove radiating too much heat. A smaller coal stove would suit us far better (Hitzer 254 rather than this giant 354).

 

Brenndatomu, I have not bought it yet, I’m still trying to figure out if it’s the right decision before spending the money. It would be a brand new stove, so any of the older issues shouldn’t be a problem. My house would fall on the low end of the sq.ft. it’s recommended for, so it may be larger than what’s truly needed. I have a 1500+ SF house, the original house is an A frame that was built in the early 80’s and not very well insulated, so majority of my heat goes right to the peak and out the roof. The other half is a single story addition that was built early 2000’s and insulated a lot better. The stove is located in an unfinished basement, so currently I’m not able to transfer all the heat generated by the stove upstairs to the living areas. I’m working on a few ideas to better fix this but as for now it’s what I got. My thought was the larger firebox and stove would allow me to run it on low for longer burn times and provide me with the 10-12 hours I’m looking for before needing to reload. I’m also not sure if this an accurate theory or not, which is why I’m reaching out for some help here. Thank you for any and all insights and advice.

 

Considering those details….they change everything…it might work fine given the uninsulated basement and high ceiling. That’s why we have these conversations, to dig for the details. Be interesting to see others comments.

Just remember the lower you burn for extended periods the more creosote will become a problem.

 

Heating an A frame from the basement, yeah, I really doubt that stove will be too big...that's gonna take some hosspower I think.
I don't know enough about them to comment on the 10-12 hr burn time potential...and that will ultimately depend on the houses heat load anyways.
Make sure the A frame part of the house has a ceiling fan or two (running in reverse during heating season) or you will never be able to feel any of that heat.

 

Agreed, I just didn’t want to inundate anyone with a whole bunch of words and details in the original post either. Since it seems like you’re into the finer details and nuances of the whole setup I’ll gladly give you the rundown on my current setup and my plans on improving it.

Currently my stove is in the unfinished basement on the addition side of my house, so furthest point away from the side the heat is needed the most. The first floor joists do have batt insulation, which is also not ideal for heat transfer from the basement to the first floor. The only spot for the heat to truly radiate to the upstairs is a 12x12 floor register which is located at the other end of the addition, so middle of the house, which is roughly 20’ away from the stove and this is how everything was when I bought the house.

So first winter living here I quickly realized how extremely inefficient this setup was and began searching through the hoardings I’ve amassed over the years for a backwoods solution. Enter a roll of heavy mill, fire retardant plastic. I essentially created a roughly 6’x6’ “room” around my stove with the plastic, leaving about 2’ of open space at the bottom for intake air. At the top of this room I then used the plastic to create a “duct” along the support beam which leads to floor register. At the floor register I then I have a small desk fan which can be plugged in to draw heat from the stove and force it upstairs. Yes, I’m sure this does have some cooling effect on the air but with how hot the room stays the air is still plenty warm enough to be 100+ coming up through the register. The fan also allows me to put a “deflector” on top of the register to divert more air to the A frame side, where it’s needed. Once the fan has run for a period of time you can shut it off and still pull a nice draft from the stove at a little higher temp but lower “speed”. This setup has worked fairly well for me over the last 2 winters but does leave some cold spots on the far side of the addition, along the exterior wall. I’ve also left the insulation in the floor joists on the addition side as to hopefully help more of that hot air move to the A-frame side of the basement and up the stairs or radiate up through the floor over there.

I’m currently in the middle of a full remodel and planning to try 2 different ideas to help better heat the upstairs more evenly. First is to run a “branch” off the plastic that will tie into the return air trunk, through the furnace and out the supply vents. My only concern with this is the distance the air must travel before reaching the upstairs and how much heat loss will be experienced.

The second option is to expand upon my current setup with multiple branches to strategic spots throughout the house. I’ll remove the insulation from certain joist bays, use plastic or coil stock to enclose them, again creating ducts, that lead to the exterior walls and then create an opening near windows and doors. I’ll keep the larger duct running along the support beam to move the largest amount of heated air to the middle of the house before it goes upstairs. Instead of using a floor register though my plan is to use coil stock to create elbows in the bottom of a wall, which will deflect 100% of the air to the A-frame side. I’m hoping by doing this in a couple key spots, especially underneath the loft where the ceiling will help retain it and allow it to spread out, this will aid in a more even heat.

So, my thoughts are for either of these to work I’m going to need to overheat the air in order for it to be warm enough to do it’s job when it finally reaches its intended destination. If you have any thoughts or experiences with something similar to these ideas please let me know if I’m way off base, should be doing something differently or mostly on track. I’m just applying basic knowledge I’ve accrued through my time in construction and making this up as I go. Thanks!

Cub

 

That was my initial thought as well, my biggest problem is not getting the heat upstairs fast enough. As far as the A frame goes I just put a new ceiling fan in last year, the remote controlled ones are a lot nicer for turning on/off and adjusting speeds when it’s 15’ in the air. My other thought was if the inside temp starts creeping a little higher than we’d like I can always turn the furnace fan on low to circulate the air throughout the house, which should help cool it off some as well as even the temperatures out. So that’s again where I was thinking/hoping it shouldn’t be too much stove.

 

I would be implementing some ideas from the past for natural air circulation throughout the house. Something similar to your “tunnel” you made for the heat coming off of the stove and the floor duct you mentioned that provides heat upstairs. If that duct is in the middle of the floor plan allowing heat to rise, then you’ll need some cold air return holes in the floor all around the perimeter of the house away from the heat entry point to allow for a more natural convection loop. It’ll work better and faster than you think. Visit some Amish older homes and you’ll likely see something along those lines that allows a house to easily warm in winter and remain cool in the summer. I’ll admit though, “A” frames can be a challenge to do either.

The biggest thing is knowing that heat wants to rise straight up off of the heat source, so pushing heat away from the source horizontally doesn’t tend to work too well. Hot air is also less dense and moves upward quickly…actually it’s forced upward by colder more dense air…but yeah…that’s the idea.

On the other hand cold air can be pushed/pulled easily. So pulling and pushing cold air from the furthest point of the home towards the heat speeds up the natural convection loop and in a hurry can better help regulate temperatures towards a temperature loop with less variation of temperature.

The floor fan in reverse in winter is a good idea in a normal home with normal ceilings. However, there are times when it’s best to leave the fan blowing down, for example in ceiling’s where heat is trapped by obstacles near the ceiling or non-flat ceilings. I have small timbers on my flat ceiling that trap heat so I leave (after experimenting) the fan blowing down because the stove is near the fan and it helps pull heat off of the ceiling. Another example where you might leave the fan blowing down in winter would be vaulted offset ceiling (different height ceilings in one open room) or a recessed ceiling. A fan blowing down in these special cases really helps rid a hot pocket of air, such as you get with an “A” frame design.

In my old house with flat ceilings and baseboard heating a fan in reverse was perfect because it pulled cool air from the floor mixed it with hot air up high and pushed warm air to the walls and down. You could always feel a gentle warmth behind you along a wall.

Now I know what I said above about leaving the fan pointing downward like in your “A” frame design because of trapped heat, but I’m going to go along with what brendatomu said about putting the fan in reverse, and here’s why I may seem to be changing my own mind, because you’re trying to speed up getting heat from the basement so you might have to help it along. Heat does want to rise and in this instance you can pull it more easily…upward. So you may want to reverse that fan as he said. Experimenting will tell you everything you need to know.

 

Yup, if there were a fan pushing cold air into the basement, the warm air will be pushed up n out...just need to distribute it where you want it.
I recall reading of someone that had a big ole 2 story house heated with a wood stove, even upstairs...it had two open stairways to the second floor and one was close to the stove...the closest one worked as the "supply" and the other the "return"...they said sometimes they had to run up/down the stairs to jump start the natural convection loop...that is a funny picture in my head!

 

Funny story, but your quote of me reminds me how much I hate autocorrect on these darn phones.

 

All very good information, thank you. I’ve actually done some experimenting with the return holes you mentioned. Having central air, all my supply registers are along the exterior of the house and connected to flex duct. Come heating season I’ll go downstairs, cut the zip ties around the boot and hang the duct next to it, allowing the supply register to act as return grille for the stove. I’m just not sure if this is the best way to create a loop as forced air supply and return vents are designed the opposite way for a reason. Also, the steps to my basement are open and on the opposite side of the house from the stove, so I do run a floor fan at the bottom of the steps to push the cold air towards the stove.

As for the ceiling fan, I’ve found that pushing the hot air down has worked best for us as it does tend to get trapped at the peak. Seeing as my current setup acts similar to a forced air furnace I don’t have any trouble getting heat upstairs, my trouble is leaving wasted heat in the basement. By the time the heat travels from the stove, through my “supply” and up to the main floor it’s still over 100F and can be felt from a few feet away. The “stove room” is typically always 120F+ and the basement outside that room is 80-90F. I’m currently trying to utilize more of that heat trapped in the basement by adding some spots for it to radiate upstairs in some key locations. For example, 2 of those spots being our master bath and the walk in closet. We like a cooler bedroom at night when we sleep so by adding vents to those 2 spots and not the bedroom itself, it should allow me to “damper” the heat by how much I close the doors to the closet and bathroom at night, keeping our bedroom cool but when we wake up we now have an extra warm bathroom to get ready in and toasty warm clothes to put on. This is a theory at the moment but this is how my mind works and it sounds good in there, for now haha

This is one thing I love about heating with a stove, the challenges and the creative problem solving skills that are born from those challenges. It keeps the mind sharp and engaged, constantly pursuing new and better ideas until we find what works for us.

 

That sounds like it has the potential to be. dangerous game of “start of the convection loop” haha

So, are you thinking it would be better/more efficient to have the “supply” air from the stove coming upstairs along the exterior wall, directly above the stove, then use my basement steps on the opposite side of the house as the “return” with a fan at the bottom pushing air back towards the stove?

 

Well, that would get heat upstairs the easiest imo...how well that distributes it upstairs depends on your floorplan I suppose

 

Besides our bedroom (which has a master bath and walk in closet) the only other room with a door/doorway would be the half bath. Everything else is completely open with the exception of a 12” header between the addition and A frame side, which can trap some heat. Stove is on the addition side which has a sunroom, our bedroom, bathroom, closet and half bath. The A frame side has kitchen, living room, loft/office and stairs to the basement. My only concern I guess would be that by the time the heated air reaches the main living areas (kitchen and living room) it would no longer be warm enough to sufficiently heat that whole A frame side. It’s also the oldest part of the house which has the most air leaks around windows, doors, sill and top plates. Windows and doors are eventually getting replaced which will allow me to hopefully eliminate some of the draftiness but the plates are a challenge I have yet to figure out, if not properly dealt with when building the house.