EPA vs Non-EPA

I'm just asking this out of curiosity as this will be my first year using an EPA certified stove. I've read on here about EPA stoves burning so much better when the wood you're burning is dried properly.

My understanding of EPA stoves vs non-EPA stoves is that you cannot fully shut off air to the EPA stoves preventing the wood from smoldering. Apparently this was a problem in the old smoke dragon stoves. I understand the safety aspect of this.

So now for my question....in theory wouldn't always having an air supply allow wetter wood to burn instead of smoldering? I can see why removing all of the air would choke a fire, wet wood or dry wood. I'm just trying to wrap my head around why older stoves are less finicky when it comes to moisture levels.

 

I guess my understanding is different than yours. My understanding is that the EPA stoves, burn the smoke, when the temperatures are at the correct ratios. They accomplish this through either catalytic converters or tubes that slow down the smoke flow rate.
So therefore they burn cleaner as smoke produces Heat. Giving you more heat from less wood.
The problem with wet wood is it cools the fire because nobody's figured out how to burn water. This lower temperature doesn't allow the smoke to burn creating more pollution.

 

It sounds to me that you are understanding it correctly. I've never thought about it in that manner. Thanks for clarifying for me.

 

Good question!
Probably won't get a scientific positive answer.

You would need a thermodynamics engineer to fully explain it.

But, my blaze king can stall the cat(in warmer temps and poor draft aka cold pipe) and smolder much like an old stove.
For me I simplify it as airflow. In my own head "in theory" Epa stoves need good draft, a good draft requires heat. (Lots of poor draft threads).
I've burned not so dry wood, low heat hard starting old non Epa stoves have trouble drafting with wet wood too. They just don't need to pull air through tubes, or special inlets that requires more draft.
Its like really dry wood and people freaking out that it will burn out of control. Only opoosite.

 

Burning the wet wood just gummed up the chimney faster.

If you are concerned about having dry wood, focus wood that doesn't need a long time to season... Ash, silver maple and pine all season very quickly. And the epa stoves don't care much about the quality of the wood in my experience.

I truly believe that the worst part about the epa stoves is that EPA moniker. It provokes a knee jerk reaction because years of political dogma have drilled into everyone's head that anything associated with the government is bad.

They should have just called them tube stoves.

 

All good points....

Also, the smoke dragons can burn wet wood by having virtually unlimited air supply..... This is not the case with the EPA stoves.

 

Politics has nothing to do with it.
I believe it's the opposite. The epa being great is what is forced into everyone. Just look at the news
People aren't stupid.
It's their Experiences that tell them everything the EPA-government is involved in goes to hell.

 

I agree with Suburban wood snob on this one....

 

Look, it's free country ... More or less. And we are free to disagree about things ... But I don't know of anywhere it's being ground into you that the epa is good. The opposite certainly is easy to find.

The fact that we are in disagreement proves my point that epa moniker carries political baggage. If for instance someone posted all there great experiences with a new kind of stove that makes no smoke and uses far less wood, you would be far more inclined to be interested in them, than if I came to you and said hey your stove is too smokey and is giving your neighbor with asthma fits...and the epa has crafted this compliance box that now shall be all you can buy.

It's just like folks game stoves for which ones have the best performance and fuel efficiency. All the ideal steal owners love to brag about the burn times and how long the wood lasts. Now if they had called themselves the epa federally mandated steel stove company they likely would have gotten nowhere..

 

Hey, we're both expressing our observations and feelings there is no wrong answer!
I more importantly respect your opinion and am interested in hearing you sharing them, as well as you hearing me.

Sadly there are people on here that will crap down your throat for having them......

Maybe it's age difference or location, but from the half dozen educational institutions I've been to, tv radio etc..anyone who disagrees with the epa assumably hates the earth, is stupid.. hates their neighbors etc... Disagree meaning not liking their or trying to not be a part of their ...deal.
I've taken full letter grade reductions for not complying.

I don't believe in force or violence...most of the time I believe in freedom good people and the free market.
The epa did not create cleaner stoves the private sector did.

Sign him on here!

 

Thanks all for the input here. I appreciate the commentary from all angles. This was just a topic out of curiosity that I wanted to better understand the logic behind it. Perhaps I should have titled this "Older stoves vs newer stoves" It was not my intention to begin a political discussion.

 

Myself, I have three epa stoves and one non-epa stove that I cannot bear to part with. I use the three but the non-epa is in storage...silently waiting.....

Dry wood, plain and simple. Dry wood.

 

Do you see my point now? Calling them EPA stoves was stupid. It colors the conversation. The reality is that they do work better... Regardless of how you measure it. Less smoke? Check. Uses less fuel? Check. I would even argue that the cost argument is irrelevant. Every thing that's not electronics or high tech cost less back in the pre epa stove Era. These things date back to 1998 after all. 500 1988 dollar is 1090 2018 dollars... Which is ironically about what a large epa compliant wood stove costs today. Drolet Ht2000 ... 3.7cubes, low emissions and it's built in Canada, not some low wage hell hole in the third world. An NC30 is even cheaper... And US made. That's progress, and I like it.

Will they cure global warming? No. Will they bring back extinct species? No. Will they fix all the ills of the world.... Obviously not. They will however cost you less to operate, reduce the fine particle pollution in your area, and help keep your neighbors on speaking terms with you.

 

If an EPA stove could brew beer there would be NO conversation on how awesome they are. It would just be common knowledge.

 

BINGO! The pollution that wood stoves make wouldn't even register on the scale compared to forest fires, volcanoes, etc, etc, etc!