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Moving from open fireplace to stove or insert

Discussion in 'Modern EPA Stoves and Fireplaces' started by Juniper Hill, Nov 30, 2020.

  1. Juniper Hill

    Juniper Hill

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    Hey everyone. So I think I will make the transition from my open fireplace to a stove or an insert. I really do not know much about either one and I am starting my research here. I burn about 6 cords per year and would like to reduce that by putting in a stove or insert. My fireplace has a hearth and sits about two feet off the ground, if that matters. Is there a difference between a stove or an insert? Do I have to get an insert because I have an open fireplace? What is the better choice? Thanks in advance.
     
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  2. moresnow

    moresnow

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    How about some pics and a complete description of the opening and inside dimensions. Is this completely masonry? Chimney opening size? How is it lined? Overall height etc.
    6 cord through a open fireplace is a pile! Wow.
     
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  3. Juniper Hill

    Juniper Hill

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    I'll have to get back with some picture and a better description of dimensions. It is a full masonry chimney and fireplace. Cinder blocks and what looks like ceramic liner up the chimney. Its a big opening at least 3x3x3.
     
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  4. Canadian border VT

    Canadian border VT

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    Ask your wife if she prefers a flush mount or stove sticking out into room. Brick hearths can be extended really depends on room size etc etc. both will do the job and give you more heat
     
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  5. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    Boy, I bet you cut your wood consumption in half with a stove in there.
    An "insert stove" is basically just a wood stove with no legs, a blower on the front (so you can clean and service it) and designed to have a fireplace opening cover (faceplate) integrated into the stove body.
    You could plunk a free standing wood stove in there and make it work...but it will heat the house better with a blower on it to move the heat out into the room...and a regular stove generally has an optional blower on the back (not accessible)...a free standing stove may be too tall also?
     
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  6. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    I started out with a stove in the FP...then took it out and added a blower on it...then took that out and replaced it with an "insert stove"...due to the whole blower accessibility issue I mentioned before...I made a steel platform for the insert to sit on (with legs) to get it up off the floor some, and make it look like a free standing stove, since I did not want to cover the arched stone FP with a big ugly black faceplate (my opinion)
    Here's the finished product...
    [​IMG]
     
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  7. eipo

    eipo

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    An insert is designed to, and must be installed in a wood burning fireplace. Whether that fireplace is masonry or a prefabbed steel box makes no difference. I suppose you could, and we get people asking about this all the time... 'can I buy an insert and install it in a corner in my living room." Well, yes you can, but that doesn't mean you should. Its the same issue with gas inserts so its not a wood only issue.

    A stove is designed to be free standing or if your fireplace is large enough you can do what brenndatomu has done and turn it into an alcove of sorts.

    I personally love the idea of a wood stove in a fireplace. There aren't many that will physically fit while providing any real heat output simply due to size limitations. I can't wait to get the MF Fire units in the store as they come standard with 3" legs on their Nova and Nova 2. The Nova is 24" high on those legs.

    Clearances are still a consideration even with a wood burning fireplace. There are clearances to combustibles both on the sides, to a mantle as well as the hearth. Those are usually specific to the unit other than hearth clearance which seems to be relatively standardized to 16" from the glass.
     
  8. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    I was of the understanding that the only way it was "legal" to install a stove in a prefab was if it said on the ID tag that it was certified to take a wood stove in it...and almost none do...
     
  9. eipo

    eipo

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    Interesting, are you referring to a “stove” or an “insert?”

    We install inserts in wood burning fireplaces, steel and masonry, with regularity. Never an issue with a specific manufacturer or code compliance.
     
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  10. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    Either...I had read that the only thing a prefab was certified for was what it was designed for, a fire directly inside it. Now common sense says that it should be even safer with a stove (or insert) inside it, than with an open fire, but you know how these insurance companies and lawyers are anymore...:picard:
     
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  11. eipo

    eipo

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    I see where I caused confusion. I was not referring to a pre fab fireplace that uses round chimney pipe. I was referring to ones where the shell of the fireplace is steel but still has block around it and a masonry chimney.
     
  12. eipo

    eipo

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    We do install gas inserts in prefab fireplaces. The chimney is perfect for the exhaust/combustion air flexible pipe. With the lower BTU output of a gas insert, it’s not an issue.
     
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  13. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    Ah, gotcha...
    Yeah I guess I wasn't clear either...I was referring to solid fuel (wood) stoves only, in regards to doing a retro install into a prefab...
     
  14. wildwest

    wildwest Moderator

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    In my words both are wood stoves, one is free standing and the other fits into the fireplace opening almost perfectly, but some fireplace openings are tall enough to fit some or most of free standing stove, just extend the flame retardent hearth if it sticks out. Plus either will bring down the humidity a bit and take the chill off seeing as you are in WA.
    Like brenndatomu you will increase heat output in a stove (either insert or freestanding) a bunch. For me the wife I prefer heat output vs whether the stove is flush or not. I bought an insert small enough to fit into our prefab fireplace from the 1950's that the owners bricked over so permanent unless we had a much bigger budget to make a grand fireplace like the gorgeous one he posted in the picture. That insert is now in storage, we put our old stove back in, bigger firebox so more heat.
    Horkn has an awesome insert that is big with great heat output, not tiny like the only one that would fit in our prefab fireplace, get the dimensions H, W, DEPTH (depth is what our prefab fireplace lacks) and start shopping:) Or, let your wife shop ;)

    You'll likely need a chimney liner for either kind of wood stove unless your chimney already has a pipe. We (husband, I helped :rolleyes:) put in a flex liner, an insulated one. Also a block off plate between the flue and the fireplace opening.

    Our fireplace opening was coated with soot I could not get off and it was stinky. Ended up spraying high temperature stove paint spray over it and that helped A LOT.

    Nice to meet you Juniper Hill and eipo :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2020
  15. Horkn

    Horkn

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    Yes, post up dimensions of the fireplace. Once you have those numbers, then you can start shopping. How long are your splits now, and how far ahead are you wood wise? There's flush mount, and ones that stick out. You need to run any options pay your decorator/ final inspector ( better half) ;)

    An insert will not only drastically cut your wood usage, but make a lot more heat and actually heat your house with it as well.

    You'll certainly need a liner. Stainless steel liner kits are not horribly priced, and are essential to making your insert work properly.
     
  16. Juniper Hill

    Juniper Hill

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    Thanks for your help everyone. Looks like I will be getting an insert. Is this something that can be DIY? I've worked construction for years and youtube videos look pretty basic for an install. Anyone out there install there own insert?
     
  17. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    [​IMG]
     
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  18. moresnow

    moresnow

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    Sure you can DIY. Getting the existing chimney inspected closely and cleaned properly prior to installing the liner should be strongly considered. What are your desired results for burning? 24/7 to offset your primary heat source? Occasional fire's? When will the fire be tended? Before and after work?
     
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  19. Biddleman

    Biddleman

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    We went the route of placing the woodstove in the fireplace. Trying to keep with the "look" of the house. Im sure we're losing some potential heating with a woodstove vs an insert, but it's working for our needs . We went from getting oil every 3-4 weeks to using less than 1/8th of a tank last year. When and if the time comes for a new stove, I'll research inserts a little more. Hopefully the rear blower lasts for many years. But when it goes, it goes and I'll just have to deal with it. 20181107_105008.jpg
     
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  20. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu

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    Nice! :yes:
    Its not so much if the motor quits, it more that the fins plug up and don't move any air...and it doesn't take too long either. Mine wasn't plugged to that point, but after a year it developed a wicked rattle...I couldn't stand it...just needed cleaned, back to whisper quiet after that.
     
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