In loving memory of Kenis D. Keathley 6/4/81 - 3/27/22 Loving father, husband, brother, friend and firewood hoarder Rest in peace, Dexterday

I just pulled the trigger on a new stove.

Discussion in 'Modern EPA Stoves and Fireplaces' started by Sean in the woods, Sep 4, 2020.

  1. Dumf

    Dumf Banned

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    A brief debrief on cats: if we were not home most of the time, working on assignments away, on a 7 to 4 shift, or on the road, a long burn quality cat stove like a BK or Woodstock would be my choice.
    For our lifestyle mostly at home, with NO central heat, no kids at home, a large woodlot to harvest the 6-8 a year, and the need to keep our butts comfy, the two non cats do the job well FOR US.
    The choices are complex, including comfort level and region.
    Most Americans have gotten acclimated to a steady temp (+/- 74 F ) at home, at work. The need for the thermostat to keep the temps steady in all rooms is all too common.
    Most northern Europeans feel no need to heat unused rooms or bedrooms 24/7.
    FOR US getting up at zero dark hundred in January with the house in the 50's is no big deal; live coals in the two Jotuls get the house up to the 70's fast enough.
    Besides, we have three ( 3 ) levels of long underwear: light wgt for active, medium wgt, and expedition. :cool::cool:
     
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  2. Longsnowsm

    Longsnowsm

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    I second that BDF, I am hopeful the Jotul performs as well as they say and will be eagerly watching for more burn reports with this stove. I am however skeptical of the 20 year warranty claims and it appears to be possibly a marketing ploy to get sales with the 20 year warranty advertising knowing they will be replacing one under warranty and then they are no longer on the hook for additional replacements. They could have said a lifetime warranty for that matter with the only obligation they have is to replace the original cat that came with the stove one time. I hope that isn't the tactic here and that the stove and cat does surprise us all. The Oslo is a beautiful stove! Looking forward to seeing how it does for new owners. I would like to know how well the air can be managed and if it can be dialed back for a low and slow burn.
     
  3. BDF

    BDF

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    Yep, I hear you and absolutely and fully agree with you. I was trying to say that but the words got in the way- my apologies for not being more clear.

    In addition to agreeing with your thoughts, I think you are making very fair, valid and reasonable statements about what you want and need from a woodstove. It would seem that you have stove(s) that do what you want them to do and again, I would be the first to strongly agree that changing to a different stove model, make or type (cat. or non- cat.) would be a step in the wrong direction.

    As I think I said, I am making less use of the long burns due to a changing situation here also, especially a new boiler that is quite efficient coupled with $1.40 / gal. fuel oil (!!!).

    Honestly, I was not debating but actually having a conversation (and a pleasant one too) on this issue and found your post excellent. If you took any part of it as negative or critical regarding your posts, I did not mean it in that way at all. I have found the exchange of ideas here on this forum to be excellent and have learned quite a lot regarding so many different makes and types of stoves that I have not and will not get to experience for myself; learning through others is the only way to collect significant knowledge IMO and I look forward to perusing the information and ideas often found here.

    Brian

     
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  4. Dumf

    Dumf Banned

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    Excellent dialogue rather than the usual....thx.
    Of all the wood stoves we've used over too many decades in New England, the Oslo stands out as the all around performer.
    And, it is the prettiest one; until we sold it.
    Most of the other temperate world does not demand the uniform kind of constant heating ( and cooling BTW ) that is demanded here.
    Norwegians and Swiss use big fluffy down comforters in unheated bedrooms. We've used them for many years. Down comforters make sleep
    and the other enjoyment in bed delightful. Heat not so much. YMMV.:cool::salute::sir::singingintherain::singingintherain::shiver::shiver::MM:
     
  5. BKVP

    BKVP

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    I spent 8 years as a little rug rat in Germany. My mom used bedwarmers with hot coals to warm up the bed before we climbed in.....she gave that practice up when my dad was transferred back to the USA! I remember those big fluffy comforters.
     
  6. Dumf

    Dumf Banned

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    We have one of those "big fluffy comforters" for winter Chris.
    LL Bean has them.
    And a lighter one for not-so-cold.
    No hot coals though ! Neat.
     
  7. Sean in the woods

    Sean in the woods

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    I agree with most of what’s been said and am also still skeptical of the 20 year warranty. I think the cat will not fall apart like the ceramic based one in my old stove, and there is a lot more surface area that should extend the life of the catalytic coating, but...

    If they were totally confident that the catalytic combustor would last twenty years, I don’t think they would have structured the warranty like they did. Maybe it is a marketing ploy that was bungled (10 years has a wow factor and would have been more believable). Or maybe they actually believe it is a revolutionary design and will last 20 years but are hedging their bets by replacing only one because they cannot know for sure at this point. I hope it is the latter. Time will tell.

    That said, I am still going through with the purchase. The length of the combustor life was only a minor selling point for me. The main reasons are:
    • Of the stoves made by the three brands I limited myself to so I could buy local, Jotul’s Oslo V3 has the lowest first hour emissions and one of the lowest thereafter.
    • Also Jotul has a good track record, so far.
    • The Oslo’s burn rate and length looks like it will work for our house and living patterns.
    • I like the look of this stove and won’t mind it being a central part of the living room during the summer when it is just an ornament.
    Thanks for all the input, I’ve learned lots. Again.

    Sean
     
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  8. Longsnowsm

    Longsnowsm

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    It is a beautiful stove. I think they have tuned it for a higher air flow and hotter burn rates to try and protect that cat and possibly extend the life. Which would explain why they list a relatively short burn time compared to many other cat stoves. We are all looking forward to your experience and sharing what you learn with this stove. Jotul makes good stoves.
     
  9. BDF

    BDF

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    Thank you for your report, and I am looking forward to hearing how things go. Jotul makes a great product with possibly the best castings I have ever seen used on a wood stove and I fully believe the stove will serve you well as a wood stove generally.

    And while there are parts of this thread that may be taken as negative, my own view is more of wariness but still hoping for the stove as well as the company to deliver. Put another way, I am absolutely NOT hoping or looking forward to a bad experience on your part.... I would much prefer the stove and your experiences with it to be perfectly successful. And of course Jotul has both a great deal of experience as well as substantial resources for stove design so it may well be that they have done things that really will allow the stove to deliver on the claims made about it. It could also be that Jotul has found and implemented new abilities that will spread to other models as well as stove brands in the future.

    So again, the very best of success with the new stove and please do keep 'us' in the loop as you move forward.

    Brian

     
  10. Dumf

    Dumf Banned

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    Excellent comments Brian !
    Jotul ( along with manufacturers such as BK, Woodstock ) have had quality and customer service as their basis.
    On the other hand, my long experience with VC has not.
     
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  11. Sean in the woods

    Sean in the woods

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    I have canceled my Jotul Oslo V3 order.

    After a long wait for the stove to come in from the Jotul USA factory, the dealer found out that Jotul will not be able to build the stove I ordered until sometime next year :headbang:. I called the factory and they confirmed this. Because of this and the quality controls issues that another new Oslo V3 owner experienced, I decided to change course and get one of the other stoves I was considering.

    Our new Pacific Energy Alderlea T6 LE should arrive this week or next. I’ll let you know in a separate thread how it goes.

    I really do appreciate the help, experience and knowledge that you all have shared. This is one of the most central decisions for our house and I needed to stick the landing.

    Thanks,
    Sean
     
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  12. fishingpol

    fishingpol

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    I was at the local Jotul dealer a few weeks ago and they really had no stoves in stock. Even the floor models were sold.

    The T 6 should work well for you.
     
  13. eipo

    eipo

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    Getting stoves right now is becoming a challenge. Its like a perfect storm between COVID, EPA 2020 and the meat of hearth season.

    Kuma has gone from a 1-2 week lead to 8 weeks.

    Jotul has had a backlog on all 4 of the stoves that are US approved.

    Osburn is about a no-show as well as its twin Enerzone.

    Morso isn't a huge seller with us, but the Distributor has 0 stoves in stock, waiting on a container that's supposed to show up "Middle of November."

    We are bringing in MF Fire, and I almost got our first order in today. Hopefully tomorrow. That backstory to MF Fire is neat, and a single burn rate stove sounds interesting.

    Kuma is a new stove to us this year and it has been a fantastic seller. We have a Cambridge set up as a burn unit and absolutely love it.

    We also have a F500 Oslo V3 set up as a burn unit... It does function well, pretty flawless actually. Its a heater though. There isn't much "low" on that stove. Between the secondaries and the CAT, that stove throws some serious heat. I'm not impressed with the burn times, it would be a much better long term heater if the combustion air could be turned down more. Its a new stove, but perhaps I should check the door and glass gaskets.
     
  14. Dumf

    Dumf Banned

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    Eipo--is the primary air slider on the V3 the same as the Oslo and other Jotuls ?
    Our old Oslo and Rangely air controls will drop well down to just enough for low combustion.
     
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  15. eipo

    eipo

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    Its similar in design and location, I do not know how much of the inlet air opening it closes off compared to the Rangely or others like the Greenville or Carrabassett.

    We are burning fairly dry wood, too. Between 12 and 15%.
     
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  16. eipo

    eipo

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    Also, I'm more of a "how long can I make this load last" kind of guy while maintaining comfort. The particular 500 we have burning in the showroom could stand to have the combustion air be closed off just a hair more from the factory.
     
  17. Sean in the woods

    Sean in the woods

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    Just out of curiosity, how long have you been able to stretch a load’s burn time in the V3?
     
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  18. eipo

    eipo

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    I’ve never been able to load it with good hardwood cut to fit the stove well. Now that I say that outloud, I’m inclined to believe that is a primary factor in the less than ideal burn times.

    I’m used to hickory, oak, beech etc at home and I forget that we are not going for extended burns here in the store, we are going for show.

    I’ll bring in some of my 20” splits of good hardwood and see what I can get for a packed stove in regards to burn time.
     
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  19. moresnow

    moresnow

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    Ii am more curious on the Cambridge burn time? 2.5 cu ft. Cat equipped. Hmmmm. Let us know. Thanks
     
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  20. eipo

    eipo

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    I’ll bring in some good hard wood for the Cambridge as well.

    With the odd sized soft maple we have been feeding it, it’s been nothing to have coals 11-12 hours after a load. It’s also doesn’t have issues boiling water on the top.