I’m completely new to burning wood for heat. Got the Ideal Steel running for a week now and not sure of anything. For the first two days I didn’t have any sort of temp measuring device because the stove didn’t come with one as they claimed, had to order some. During the two day waiting period I’ve been doing a lot of reading and figured I needed to get a cat probe and IR gun as well. Anyway, the first two days it seemed as everything was great but it felt very hot and I was concerned with all the over firing warnings. Since I have installed thermometers it seems like nothing is going right anymore. I don’t see the secondary burn anymore, glass has blackened and no matter what I do I can't get a warm fire, it’s always just hot. I’m not sure if I’m engaging the cat at the right time or which thermometer to trust and build a routine from there. In the pics I’m showing the gun reads 538, cat probe 1,500 and stove top thermometer at 650. I checked the chimney pipe thermometer and it looks as if it matches the gun at 288. Maybe I’m just overthinking it but I am concerned about damaging this investment because it wasn’t cheap. Any tips or information would be greatly appreciated.
450-650 on the front face seems to be a good temp on mine. However, this is my first season with the IS, as well.
I have the midwest hearth thermometer as well as the condar chimgard probe and the same IR thermometer. The midwest hearth seems to match up nicely with my IR thermometer. The midwest hearth does lag behind getting an accurate reading as any stove top thermometer will. My flue probe seemed to read high out of the box. What I did was let it sit out overnight to cool and then adjusted it to match room temp as close as I could. It seems much more accurate now. Edit: I run a tube stove though so no info on how to help you with the IS but there are a lot of other members that will be able to help. Welcome to the FHC!
bzsprinkler first welcome to the FHC I got same stove so here you go. If pipe is single wall I think it is. Make sure thermostat about 16 inches above stove top. Wait till thermostat says about 275* ish close cat by pass Drop air intake from wide open to about 3/4 Wait 5 to 10 minutes If cat is new closer to the five minutes as a cat gets older it will take a little longer. Lower air intake that little less than half wait 5 min Set air where you need to. this all assumes your wood is dry otherwise you are going to fight the stove!
I've had my Ideal Steel for 4 years now and it's a great heater. It can definitely make a good hot fire. I have the same or similar temp tools as you, and my primary temperature reading I use and go off of is the catalyst probe. I will build my fire, let it get going good with the door closed after it's been going well for a few minutes. I keep my air open all the way or turn it down to the 3/4 mark until the cat probe reaches 500 or a little over that. At that point I close the bypass and engage the catalyst and keep the air at 3/4 or full for a few more minutes to let the cat get going. After another 5 to 10 minutes I'll turn the air down in increments, usually to half and then down to quarter where it will stay for the rest of the burn. If I want a good hot fire I will keep the air at half and I'll get the cat probe to 1200 to 1400 degrees. My catalyst is getting at the end of its life so it doesn't get as hot as it did when new. Everyone is going to run their stove a little differently due to different set ups and situations. It's a learning curve and you will get a handle on it after working with it for a while. How far down do you turn your air when you get the black glass? If you turn it down too quick or too much you'll loose the secondary burn and get dirty glass. The temps show you were running the catalyst and it was definitely doing its job, and the dark glass with no secondaries would be normal at a low air setting. Don't worry about the over fire threat, these stoves can take a lot and you're temps are still okay, on the low end of high is what I'd say. Keep working with it and you will learn the little things your stove and setup is unique to. Have a great time and you have a great stove. enjoy it!!!
Thanks for the welcome. I was thinking of firing up my Big Green Egg tonight since I have a Fireboard digital thermometer and try to calibrate the cat probe. Out of all the gizmos the IR gun reads the coolest and I would think be the most accurate of the 3 on the stove front.
Thanks for the help. I feel like this is similar to the routine I have been trying to follow, I picked up a moisture meter today because from reading on here it seems like most of the time it's wood that hasn't cured enough
I literally sat in front of the stove last night to watch how things were reacting and at what temps. I first closed the bypass at 600 with air 100%, temp started to fall. Tried again at 800, temp fell. Third time at 1,000, air at 100% temp began to rise, closed air to 3/4 then to 1/2 by 1,200 cat probe temp., waited a few minutes then down to 1 notch below 1/4 got up walked away. When I came back temp was around the 1,650 mark so I decided to take the pics. Temp dropped down to 1,500 by the time I got my phone, had a short conversation and came back, about 5 minutes, but the IR gun said the surface temp was 538. The manual throws out that 1,400 temp warning and damage so I was getting worried seeing numbers above that. Also, I hope it settles out soon because no matter what I do or set the air at it runs up to 1,500-1,600, it's like it's all or nothing hot with this stove. I believe you are correct with the black glass and turning it down too fast, following the manual, it says to turn it to a 1/4 and close the bypass, boom, black glass. I haven't seen secondaries in 2 days, I'm trying to get a slower milder burn. I reload morning and evening, but again it's all or nothing hot when it gets going. Is there a different method for a slower burn around 1,200 or so? I know it's going to be a learning curve and I greatly appreciate your advice, I just didn't want to break the dang thing before I could figure out how to use it.
When you closed the bypass at 600 and 800 degrees on the catalyst probe, how far did the temperature drop? How long did you let it go before opening the bypass again? That's strange as the catalyst should be igniting after 500 degree mark. I can hear my catalyst almost sizzling and making a hissing sound when I first close the bypass and watch the cat probe climb in temp. What is your chimney setup?
Those probe type expansion thermometers are not very accurate generally so I would not put much stock in the readings. Plus they are extremely slow to respond. A thermocouple reading device is much better for reading cat. temps. IMO, and much, much faster as well. Where are you setting the draft? The I.S. with very good draft will run with the air adjustment fully closed; it does not really every close and the small openings left (front draft along the door glass and secondary draft) are still significant. The stove top temp. at 650F is pretty hot- not dangerous but you will not get a long, slow- to- medium burn that way but rather a hot and fast burn. MY I.S. normally runs around 400 - 450F stove top (measured at the hottest point on the stove top) unless it is unusually cold outside. As you have an IR temp. reading device, the fastest thing to change will be your stove pipe because it is quite thin. All other readings will lag well behind what the stove is really doing; it takes quite a while to change the stove top temp. even if the firebox / cat. temps. are moving up very quickly. Your wood is a bit wet so you will have a tougher time lighting the cat. and throttling the stove initially. I would suggest running with the draft wide open until the stove pipe outside reading gets to 350F or so, then cutting the draft down to 1/2, and again waiting until the stove pipe temp. hits around 300F, then finally turning the draft down to 1/4 and closing the bypass. That will give you time to drive off a lot of the water in the wood and make sure the new fuel is well engaged before greatly damping down the stove. Brian
I probably didn't wait long enough to give it a chance to climb due to the lack of confidence in my know how and tools used. I will try again tonight with a little more patience. Chimney is straight out the top, through the ceiling and roof with cap.
Thanks for your help Brian, that is my goal in the end, is to be able to control it and know what temp I want and how to achieve it. All of these tips and advice are building my confidence
For the display and data recording, I use one like the one shown here: K Type Thermometer Thermocouple 4 Channel Meter SD Card Logger -328 to 2498°F | eBay Though I did not buy mine from that source and have no idea how that vendor is so cannot recommend the vendor of course. For the thermocouples, I use two different types. One is like this: 2M High Temperature -100~1250 Degree Thermocouple K type 100mm Probe Sensors | eBay though from a different vendor as well. These go in the cat. probe position (Easy Boys!, not that kinda' cat), into the firebox and into the smoke pipe. The stove top I just use a glass insulated, open thermocouple from someplace such as Omega (company name). I just put the thermocouple on top of the stove, at the hottest point, and hold it there with a magnet. All the thermocouples will respond in less than one second. We tend to think of wood stoves as very slow to respond but that is not really the case- the flue gas temp. will change w/in 2-3 seconds of making a draft adjustment if the device making the measurement is fast enough to respond. The readout is also a data collector so it can be set up to record data, which allows the overnight data to be checked at any time. Put into a graph form, I find it extremely useful to tell how long, how hot and then how efficient the stove has been running. If you do not care about storing the data for later review, a much less expensive, four- channel thermocouple readout can be had for around $20 from Ebay. This is on example: 4-Channel K-type Thermocouple LCD Thermometer Temperature Meter (-50~1350°C) | eBay Brian
Glad to help when / if I can. It really is a bit of a skill to burn wood efficiently. Of course on some level it is nothing but a 'fire in a box'; the box is purchased and our ancestors figured out how to make fire a long time ago..... But if you want long, efficient burns, it takes some advanced planning to have enough dry wood readily available, and a bit of learning to have it serve you better. Lots of folks around this forum ready and able to help though, and with things like digital photos and notches on draft settings I think we can exchange info. pretty well. Better than Trog and Gorth did 10,000 years ago anyway; I can not even imagine how that conversation went ('Trog, I make fire like this.....'). Brian
Brian, I followed your advice to the letter and it seemed to work perfectly. Awesome advice, thank you. I also moved the stove top thermometer to the stove top just left of the flue collar which is the hot spot, it seems to match up with IR gun in that position as well. When it was time to engage the bypass with the stove pipe returned to 300 and intake set to 1/2, the cat probe was at 1,200. Closed bypass and set air to 1/4, ate dinner, came back to these readings (pics attached) Stove top - 471 Stove pipe - 307 Cat probe - >1,600 (IR gun says 575 on the face next to cat probe) I also checked all of the wood with the moisture meter too, everything between 17-21%
Now bring some wood inside, if you have room a few days worth would be great, place it a safe distance from your stove, and let that wood get a little drier and it will also warm some as well. This will allow the wood to dry out a little more as well as be much warmer so as not to drop your inside stove temperatures so much when you reload. I have a place to stack wood, but a few 5gallon size metal pails from your local Tractor Supply Company found near the chicken feed and you can fill them with wood. This keeps the mess down as well as makes things easier to carry.
Great- glad to hear you are having better success. Once the stove is stable at the 1/4 draft setting, you will be able to adjust the draft to suit your heat needs. An I.S. at 1/4 draft opening with a strong chimney draw will still run quite warm; well w/in the limits of the stove and general safety of course but it will put out a lot of heat and have a relatively short burn time. If you need that much heat output that is fine but I just wanted to mention you can turn the stove much further down if that will meet your heat needs and result in a longer, more efficient burn. Brian
