Woodstock's new steel stove

I'm going to assume steel versus soapstone.
ETA: Ray types faster.

 

My old stove was a convention type. I can't tell any difference between it and soapstone. I have a much more even heating curve now but a cat in a steel stove should handle that.

 

That is an interesting question. At this point.. about 5 burns and 3 of them at very low capacity break-in burns, it is too early to say much.

Additionally the Garrison, was a "hybrid" steel and soapstone stove. Soapstone top with a lot of firebrick (I don't think that was soapstone) inside, and a pretty complex baffle system for in-flow and out-flow air, all around a cold-rolled steel outer layer.

Having said that, my initial take on this is the Fireview is a less dramatic heat with much more manageable temperature. When it gets to 250'F (read from the top cover stone) and I engage the cat, it is easy to manage the heat in order to NOT blast us out of the living room. The result seems to be a more pleasant (I've heard it called "softer" heat) and that fits, but I think at this point I'd call it a more comfortable heat in the big room it's in, and it also seems to be better at "distributing" the heat to the boundaries of the room and even the back rooms of the house. (I'll use floor fans for this later in the year). This distribution may be just because the heat is a lower temp, but longer duration steady state heat. It's impressive that I can let the temp rise to say 350'F on the top plate of the stove and it will stay locked in at that for many hours.. and this is only on a few small splits. So I think the "manageable steady state" aspect may be what then gets called gentle.. or soft, heat.

Charlie eluded to this with his PH in another thread, and he mentioned it is also a result of the mass of the stove. So maybe the way soapstone absorbs and then slowly radiates the heat provides the basis for a stove that then becomes much easier to manage almost like a thermostat controlled heating system. The result is a more "comfortable" heat.

Now ask me this again when I'm 24X7 and have had a while to have the stove really become a full time heater and this opinion may change. So far my wife seems much more pleased with the warmth this one provides than what we used to have.. but this may be it's good looks has her charmed at this point.

 

I'm hoping it all comes together. I wanted the Progress to work for me, but there are too many doubts that it would fit my needs. This stove has a larger firebox and should be what I'm looking for from a performance standpoint.

Considering who is making it, it should be a much better looking, cat version 30NC with 20-25 hours of usable heat. That would tickle the hell out of me.

 

Me experience?

I felt little difference between the Vigilant and 30NC in terms of it's "blast radius." When both are cranking it is mighty difficult to distinguish the difference of the two. Good luck standing near either of the bastards!

Also, I felt littler difference in the Heritage at 600-650 than I do with the Encore at the same temp.

 

BBar,
I still can't believe you need 3 stoves to heat 2150, even though drafty! That must be real bad drafts and no insulation. My PH is in a 1200 sq ft room, with cathedral ceilings, and floor to ceiling glass around 3 sides (old drafty windows that do not close properly, and leak between panes). All that is on the upper floor, with another 11 or 1200 on the first floor below. The PH (on the upper floor) bakes us in the great room, and keeps the below floor above 65, for a full 8 to 10 hours with a full load and in the 20's outside. The great room stays above 70 for 12 to 16 hours, and above 65 for a few hours longer (as the soapstone continues to release heat even though the fire was nothing but a few ambers for hours).

I can only imagine, if my house floors were reversed, and the stove was on the 1st floor, it would have no problem heating the entire house above 70 for 12-16 hours easy in dead of winter.

 

I have several hurdles I am faced with:

Awful L-shaped floor plan. (looks awesome, but it blows when it comes to heating)
No basement or crawl space. At all. Seriously. Lift up a wood plank and you will see rock and dirt no more than six inches below.
Stone walls.

Even if I replace all the windows and doors, I do not know how much this will help. In November I am insulating the hell out of the attic. We'll see if that minimizes the cold air that is being sucked up from the floor. I have my doubts.

I'm also going to stack hay bales along the outside of certain portions of the stone walls to see if the cold air coming in through the floor can be minimized. If it makes a differences I at least can determine where the leaks are.

Fact is, even with awesome insulation/doors/windows I would probable still need three stove for whole house heating. Just three stoves the size of the Keystone rather than the big SOBs I have now.

 

Oh, one thing I still don't understand and want to "study" a bit to figure out;

You guys mention getting stove tops and sides to 500-600-700. I never see the top or side of the PH go above 425, and even that is only during the peak of a rager. Yet, it is cranking heat out like I have never felt a stove do (other peoples stoves...). The room will be 90, I have to open windows... But the stove is only showing 350-400 tops, for hours on end. And all the while, the pipe temp is only 250.

It's almost like the PH releases the heat rather than hold it via high surface temps. But then again, all the soapstone mass holds that heat for a l-o-n-g time, which goes against it not holding the heat. I have to try to wrap my head around this.....

 

Bingo. I'd think the stone walls are a killer! They are just sucking up heat. My buddy just had his house analyzed (pressure tested...) by a freind of his, just for kicks. The guy who had been in that biz for 40 years told him his house was very poorly insulated which he already knew. But, he also said don't bother insulating it, because he finds most houses loose heat and AC from drafts and materials (stone, brick, cement walls) than anything else. The house has very high out of the ground cement footing/walls (6'), and that was his biggest problem.

Try foam insulating below the floor, if there is 6" of space there. Bet that would help. Not sure what you could do with the stone walls, that's a tough one!

Man, feeding 3 stoves must get old!

 

I wish I could give a Progress a test run for a month to see what it's like. When I had the Hearthstone Heritage, I could get it up to 600 with no problem and it would pour out heat. Problem was, the burn times were super short considering.

I want to know how much that 750 lbs changes the way it heats an area.

 

That is one of the options. But it is a more expensive that doesn't guarantee it will be worth the cost. I need to determine where the leaks are coming from first.

For the most part, it isn't bad. But, January and February blow. By the first week of February I want to move back to Arizona. I'm looking into a pellet add-on boiler. Something to run in the background that will give me 60 hours per load while on low to even out the heat and lengthen burn times on the stoves. Not sure if it is worth it or not right now.

I'm hoping, HOPING, that packing the attic with insulation will drastically change things. I almost think that the heat loss in the roof is causing a suction like effect with the air leaks underneath the first floor. Past experience with this house dictates that won't be the case, though.

 

FYI, re-read my post above, I fixed all the damm "autocorrect" crap. Geesh, hate typing on the iPad.

Well, I can't compare it to any thing, but I can certainly tell you I have to be carefull with what I feed it, cause she will heat my house and a few of my neighbors houses if I feed her too much. But it's a long slow, brutal death of heat! That's why I need to be careful, because if I over feed her, it's not just a 3 or 4 hour "problem", it can be an overnight problem! I think that is the kind of "problem" your looking for.

By the way, take a PH home and try it, with their liberal return policy just bring back when test is over. I assume they bank on the fact you'll likely end up keeping it. But good luck moving the beast around. Mines never moving again!

 

LOL! I get that!

 

Anyone that saw my install pics knows EXACTLY what I'm talking about!

 

I see your temps, yet on my PH I get stove temps of 500 along with flue pipe gases that match all on a low burn, completely closed... My wood is very dry I'm using , right now, it's all two year old standing dead, cherry, elm, and ash, 3-5 inch splits... I'm wondering if your wood is not that dry... I agree 100%,,, the PH just pushes out lots of amazing heat with just coals !!!!!! And for hours... I've never packed the stove chuck full yet.... I'll have to work up to that... this thing is a serious heater... I'll can tell you last year with the Fireview, same outside temps, we'd be down to 68 in the morning burning the same amount of small wood, last load in at 9 pm.. By 9 am , now with the PH, it's 74 in here.. I always expect to see some wood in the stove for the amount of heat, but surprisingly the coals are doing all the work... I'm thinking once I put some serious wood in the PH, it will heat my whole Farmhouse,, and our rooms are all broken up.. No open floor plan here. Stove room is 18 x 30 with doors at each end that lead into the rest of the house.. so the air can circulate nicely... This means I 'll be burning less wood in the Esse cookstove.. I'll just keep a big coal bed in the Esse,, which has a firebox just shy of a 6 inches deep .. Once that's filled with coals they will last at least 12 -16 hours for an easy relight of more wood..

 

Machria, I'm a new soapstone burner, so I don't have the experience, and I think we would all agree that every installation is different with may variables; wood, draft, outside temps, room sizes etc etc.. But, my experience so far with my Fireview. and it is minimal, just a few burns and none with a full stove or even a really cold day, indicate more of what you are seeing on your PH as far as temps. I get it to 250 on the top stone and engage the cat.. set the draft for about 1.5 - 2.0 for a bit and the temps climb to 350 - 400. At the same time, the flue temp drops like a rock from > 450'F down to 250'F simultaneous to the rise in stove temp as the cat does it's thing.

My wood is about 2 full years old, mainly oak, with a moisture reading in a fresh split around 22%, large pieces somewhat higher.. but not much. It's dry enough to burn nicely but it isn't that below 20% dry that Charlie's wood prolly is. I'm guessing Charlie is right, when he points at the wood as the probably difference, but I'm not sure I'd want the stove getting up that hot that easy, maybe I'll change my mind on that as the cold weather actually gets here, but right now I seem to have a manageable fire and medium heat which is nice for this shoulder season. It could be I'm just not making big fires too, but it is going to be fun experimenting and getting to know the stove over the coming months.

The weather is supposed to turn here over the next few days. They are talking cold weather for Wednesday for the Red Sox game, with a potential for snow flurries. That's the raw cold we get heah in Bahston!

 

I also think I have a really good draft as well.. I want to get a manometer and check my draft sometime.. I'm burning from my extra rack that I use before I get into my main wood,, kind of my shoulder season wood, all really dry...most with no bark at all..