Chain critiques wanted

All 3 pics, same cutter.

 

I already think I know the answer, but lay it on me. The pics are of one of the worst cutters.
This is a Windsor full chisel. Been lightly rocked several times and hand filed several times. Similar symptoms for the last several sharpening. Eventually, it required excessive pressure to cut good...easy to apply with the dogs hooked in, but not fun when reaching with the bar. Throws nice big chips and the rakers are slightly below specs. As if, its sharp- just doesn't want to hook in. To my amateur eye, he profile of the cutters looks good from the bottom (except for this pic) but there is still damage on the top. I've been thinking, The "angled" portion cuts, as long as the edge is sharp what difference does the top of the cutter make?
This pic of the bottom side doesn't look good and top side damage is visible, but lets hear it from the pros.

 

It doesnt look like tje right angle to me? The angle on the top plate. It looks to shallow. What I mean is that top plate doesnt look like 30-35 degrees to me looks like 20-25 maybe? Which means its not going to get as sharp a point to cut out a chip as easy.

But I flat just be the way the picture is taken? Get one from top of chain looking down.

I also meant to say the raker look pretty low. More than low enough!!

 

I thought I knew the a

Rakers are slightly below spec.
I use a (stihl?) guide. 30 degrees. I think thats what Windsor specs. No witness marks on the cutters.
Sorry. Not the best pics, phone camera didn't want to focus. Stuck a leaf in/behind the chain to give it something to focus on. Camera angles probably not the best either.

 

Yea 30 is spec but I bet those raker a few thousands below spec if not more by the looks?

But forget the raker. Thats not the problem. So hour sure its filed to 30 degrees??

Try a new chain somethings wrong with that one, or is every chain you file get this problem eventually?

 

Throwing big chips but you need to push down to get results? I'm no good at judging chains with pictures but the story you tell sounds like the bar may have some nasty burrs on it? Take the chain off and run your fingers from the bottom to top of the bar if your fingers get caught at all on any part of the bar that could be your problem or at least part of it, take a flat file and file them off

 

Hard to tell but from the pics it looks like your filing on a downward angle?

 

Your working corner is dull. Pic with leaf looks like you have a good arc down the side plate but the other pics are not showing hook cause the corner is blunt.

 

What size file are you using ?
Is that .375 chain ?

 

Your top plate angle is way off. Looks more like 15 degrees to me. Swing your fill angle back towards the power head. Make sure your file is all the way down into the gullet. This helps with your hook which controls self feeding. Your rackers a way low, make sure you are using your file guide correctly. I messed up with mine the first few uses.

 

The bar suggestion is a good one and I agree check it especially the area you use most.

And what square file said that inside of cutter looks dull, almost like semi chisel?

And I still think your top plate angle is wrong almost like your filing more perpendicular to the bar than you should.

And like the others said I think those raker are a good bit below spec for what amount of tooth is left. But the raker are not the problem. If it was self deciding it would be very bumpy and virbrating from them and either stall and or rip the saw out of your hands.

 

The correct file should necessitate the gullet being filed separately.
If the file being used gets the gullet at or near the bottom, there is no way that the top plate/hook is done correctly at the same time


It looks like the file is too large of a diameter as well as too shallow of a top plate angle

 

What is the purpose for underlining quotes?

 

Had the whole post quoted and underlined that part. Didn't look right, so I removed the rest of the quote.

I suppose the underlined could be a halfway spot between just quoting it and making it bold ..............
To me that statement that's underlined just doesn't make sense .............. hey, look at that .......... it makes it easier to refer to as well

 

Is that semi chisel ? or is the corner rocked out still on chisel ? If it is rocked it will cut like that ,but not real good till you take the cutter back past the rocked point so you have a pointy outer corner if it is chisel chain ,a grinder may be needed to fix a rocked out chain if very bad .

 

Top pic makes me believe its semi

 

I think its semi chisel from that pic of the inside of the cutter but didnt he say its chisel? That thing is either been cutting dirt or jacked up angles or both?

 

Two things, it looks to me like too large a file for the size chain, also you said there is still damage on the top plate, this has to go, the sharp edge has to be right at the top.
You state it is full chisel chain yet I see no sharp point at the corner.
Your best bet is to get a new chain and file the old one to look just like it, you can do it it just takes practice.

John

 

I'll try to get more pics at better angles.
I've dressed the bar, it seems fine.
The angle is 30 according to my file guide.
3/16 file, .325 chain.
Depth of file is set by the guide.
It is a full chisel, i took a pic of one of the worst links to try to get the problem to show. After zooming the pics, it looks bad and does look like a semi chisel.

Most of the cutters look good viewed from the bottom. The point of the cutter looks nice and sharp, not like a semi chisel at all. But viewed from the top, a tiny bit of damage to the point is visible. I was wrongly thinking this tiny bit of visible top damage was negligible. After filing the damage out of 90% of the cutters, its back to cutting good (compared to a new chain) without excessive pressure. I was mainly looking for verification with this thread, but the cutter/pics I posted look bad. Thanks for all the help and if you have any more suggestions, I'm all ears. I'll try to post some better pics of a better cutter and let y'all see if it looks good to you. Thanks guys.