If looking at a new catalytic woodstove, consider the price of the combustor

For anyone considering a new wood stove and looking at catalytic models, please be aware that the price of 'a combustor' varies widely between different stoves, even those of similar size. There are many different size and shape combustors and each stove takes a particular one so the stove choice can have a major impact on how much it costs to use a wood stove over time.... say, 10 years if the combustor is changed every 2 or 3 years. A new combustor can range in cost from just over $100 to nearly $400- quite a range and the more expensive combustor will not last any longer or perform any better, the only difference is the physical size and shape, not the chemistry of the combustor or the catalytic process.

Another thing to consider is the level of difficulty and mechanical complexity to access the combustor as well as outright change it. Again the range is very considerable with some combustors accessible from inside the stove only, and often behind screens or deflector plates, sometimes using fasteners to hold them in place; after a few years, those fasteners can become pretty difficult to deal with. Other stoves make combustor access extremely easy and outright removal as simple as lifting the combustor out (held in place by nothing but gravity).

So I would suggest the cost and access be considered on any new woodstove purchase. They all work fine when new but they also all require occasional replacement.

Brian

 

Nice. Some good points.

I'm in the rdust line of thinking, and would spend $300 every year, if I had to. It really does work that well. But it has been three full heating seasons, and I have no reason to. Even the gasket is in good shape.

Access is a very good point. Woodstock has the upper hand on that one, and BK is right behind. Both are easy to get to, and require no tools.

 

I think you missed my point entirely Dennis- I was not trying to scare people away from cat. based stoves, in fact quite the opposite and I would not consider any [non cat. based] stove for my own use.

The point was to do a little bit of research on ALL the stoves anyone would consider purchasing and be aware of the longer term costs beyond just the purchase price. In fact, there is no scenario where I think a non- cat. stove can compete with a cat. stove regarding the cost over some reasonable period such as 10 years because cat. based stoves simply burn so much less wood (on average). The savings in wood cost and effort alone are worth the price of the cat(s) and the savings in chimney cleanings are icing on the cake.

I think most people do not really consider the overall cost of owning and operating a stove over a period of years. It is basically the stove price, chimney (if needed) and installation (is purchased) and all stoves are compared directly. No one would buy a car without thinking about the fuel economy, maintenance costs, insurance costs and probably even tax costs yet I think that is exactly how most wood stoves are purchased: it comes down to these three, say, and the best looking one is chosen.

I would suggest people looking at wood stoves who are new to burning wood, and even those who are not, consider actually using and maintaining that stove for multiple seasons. How will you get the ashes out? How much ash will it hold before needing to be emptied? How easy is it to clean the glass? How does the stove load and how does that work for the stove owner (bad back making a low stove a problem? left or right handed person and which way does the door open? And lots more questions like this). The room my stove is in is ideal for a left side loading stove; a right side loading stove could be used but it would be much less convenient.

But the specific point about the cat. price and effort was to perhaps make a couple of people aware, in advance, that stove choice will directly affect operating costs down the road. It is not sufficient to lump all the cat. based stoves together and treat them as a single cost entity because that is not how it works.

Brian

 

BK has a pretty great warranty on their cats and I know WS has stood behind their customers as well.

As Jeff posted above I'd replace my cat ever year without blinking an eye if I had to. The stove is that good.

 

Having known Brian for such a short time on FHC, I feel like we are definitely on the same page when it comes to woodstoves. In particular the WS IS. I like BDF's information on catalysts in woodstoves. This is a good set of tips on what to look for in a catalyst burning stove. Location, ease of access, materials the cats are made of, typical lifespan and replacement cost are all things to consider when doing stove research. Thanks for posting

 

Agreed on the research and I think it is much more important on an item like a woodstove than many other items, such as furniture, <most> electronics, etc. As an example, if we were to consider the purchase of something like a cell phone (smartphone specifically), they all have an upfront cost, and then a monthly fee. But the ongoing fees are the same, so the phones can be compared pretty directly regarding features, performance and initial cost. That is NOT the case with a woodstove because the running costs will actually be greater than the purchase cost, and I am including the cost of either buying or procuring wood in this scenario, yet they are basically compared with up- front cost only. At least that is how it seems to me.

And I don't think this thread degenerating will be a problem considering there is currently a thread going on about what data someone records in his bedroom.....

Brian

 

Yes, I believe I read that they (BK) is offering a 10 year warranty on the combustors in their stoves? If so, that is an ideal example of something to consider when purchasing a new stove! Some BK cat.s are quite expensive and if replaced every 2 or 3 years of heavy use, that warranty could be worth a very significant amount of money over that 10 years.

Brian

 

Thanks for the kind words.

The I.S. is my first modern, commercial wood stove but I have been burning fire wood for a long time and think I have been able to detect at least some of the pitfalls of tending a stove 24/7/ [as long as heat is needed]. It is sort of like getting married vs. a date: a date that is not great lasts a number of hours, a marriage that is not great can seem to last forever and forever . There is a huge difference between looking at woodstoves in stores or on- line, and comparing spec.'s, size, etc., etc. vs. feeding and tending one for dozens to hundreds of man-hours. The things that seemed important when shopping may be quite different than what is important on that Feb. night, when it is 7F outside and you are sick of frolicking with the stove and yet it still has to be done.

So I just kind of wanted to throw the thought out there for the newer wood burners and wood burner wannabe's to try and consider a longer view than how that new, shiny woodstove will look on that hearth....

Brian

 

Yea
I saw the cat, 10 year warrantee on BKs somewhere.

The fine print of the long warrantees seem to have a statement like
"Performance will vary depending on hours of operation"
" 12000 hours for combustor replacement for good performance."
Not sure if BK put that in their fine print.

BK King, combustors are one of the most expensive, must be the bigger size.
but they crank the heat out a long time

 

Stoves all come down to personal preference. After they reach a certain efficiency, then it really doesn't matter which one you choose. The decision for a stove is more based on situation than performance.

 

I can't totally agree with your post, no offense. My choosing a stove really came down to function and performance. Looks and aesthetics are not factors but would be a bonus if it comes that way.

 

Most modern stoves reach a point where a little bit of difference in efficiency isn't going to matter much. Besides, I would sacrifice for a kiva.

 

Good post. I've been thinking about this subject since it came up in another thread. I never really thought about the hours verses years life of a cat til this year.

I think It makes sense that serious 24/7 burners with cat stoves should look into the cost of replacements every 2-3 years if they want to continue peak performance. I think the warranty is only for the first replacement after purchasing a new stove, after that is all on you?

Replacement cost is probably more of a concern for people that purchase wood since $300 can buy 2-3 cords of wood around here, that's a full seasons worth for me.

Maybe the s/s cats have a longer life, anyone know? I know they don't fall apart like a ceramic but they still use the same substrate or metals so maybe they are the same life span.

 

I read somewhere that a new cat for the Ideal Steel is $125.00? Heck, that that price, I'll buy three of them and have them sitting in storage. The entire cat stove experience is still new to me. Dark firebox, but the stove cranks out heat. That makes as much sense as getting buzzed off empty beer cans, but I'll take it. Now, time for a full beer can.....

 

I don't know anyone that has had to use the BK cat warranty. I have the 10 year warranty on mine and it is supposed to be 100% replacement and not some pro-rated jive. However, since it is normal to lose 25% of function over 12000 hours then has the cat really failed if after 12000 hours it has lost 25%?

Has anyone warrantied a BK cat? They are nearly 300$.

Here's the warranty

http://www.blazeking.com/PDF/10_year_combustor_Extended_Warranty_Aug2012.pdf

Is it a defect if the cat declines as expected? You have to buy a new cat from the dealer and then hope that BK confirms defect before getting a refund.

 

Be interesting to find out.

I threw my crumbled ceramic one away. Should at least went to the dealer & see what they'd say.
They only carry ceramic & I wasnt' gonna go that route again.

 

Besides just getting a new cat, deciding between SS and ceramic is another tough one.