Endurance 50 & control board troubleshooting

Page 28 figure 13 of the manual. Also how was the draft setup?

 

Ahh more food for thought.
You'll be able to tell I've not had much time troubleshooting this lately.
Here's a pic of the over limit switch I was talking about--it's part of the blower switch.

 

The unit is from 2014. Using a Maine softwood pellet. Maine Woods Pellet

The vacuum and POF switches are something I haven't really looked into. I probably should, but the reason I haven't is because the folks at Fahrenheit gave no indication that they would cause an Auger Timeout code.

Smokey, when you talk about soot behind the POF switch causing a time out at startup, are you talking about Endurance 50 specifically?

The other reason I'm still leaning heavily towards the control board is because with the back panel taken off, I can see that the auger motor itself isn't spinning at all. Won't even turn when I push prime. But if I hook the auger directly to the 34.5kV transmission lines out back, it spins great (just kidding). It does spin with 120 mains though.

After the realization that testing triacs, relays, and other board components is over my little head like a June noon sun, I'm basically waiting for the dealer to come out and test the unit with another control board. If I get time I might have a peak at those other switches though. Unit was cleaned fairly recently (not by me).

 

As a general rule the POF is located were it is up against the exhaust system some devices (like my no longer used device)have it in the exhaust air stream. I wasn't being Endurance specific. It is rare for me to talk about a specific device. Some of the old devices used to look for the light from the flames, ain't that right Snowy?

 

You understand the sail switch in particular can cause spastic auger feeding and that the love-joy connector rarely gives joy or love. Set screws on the round and not up against the flat can lead to spastic auger feeding. Never look at the low odds cause when simple to fix and cheap fixes can be the case.

 

I just had this happen to me this morning, I pressed the prime button and auger worked fine. So I started it back up, and I notice that the air coming out of blower was over 210, so I pulled out the filter and a couple minutes later I was down to 150, go figure!
Check your blower filter if you don’t have air blowing around your stove and cooling it your furnace will over heat and shut down the auger.

 

No comment that was a no cost ( at least in parts, hi odds cause and fix).

 

Can anyone tell me what the air-pump is for on the Endurance?
The vacuum confirmation is via the sail switch, correct? No vacuum pressure switch. What's the vacuum pump doing?

 

The vacuum pump is actually the air pump it is used to start things like corn by raising the ignition temperature within the allotted time. The sail switch detects the existence of airflow in the vent system.

 

Well this has been a bit of a slow burn project, but I finally was able to spin the motor with a new board. Sail switch and everything else checked out.

It still seems exceedingly unlikely that the previous new board was defunct from the factory. Does anyone have knowledge about whether the auger motor could damage the board? The resistance value across the motor leads seems to check out, but it just seems like something had to have messed with that board.

 

Strange indeed! There has been known of faulty boards out of the package which I think these are made in China(not a good thing). I would add a good surge protector before going any further.

 

Yes, good call on the protector.

Apparently these boards are made in New York. And they can be sent for diagnostics/repair, which the dealer is doing I think. I bet many of the components come from China though.
The Fahrenheit folks are sort of recommending I also replace the auger motor to play this safe.

 

This is what a lot of us use. About $30 on 'Zon

 

If your original board caused a low voltage feed to the auger that was continuous it could damage the field windings causing them to heat up and possibly short between them. There should not be any ghost voltage unless a component failed. (Triacs are just an on-off switch controlled by a low voltage signal) Thus causing more current draw which probably finished your old board. Installing the new board (possibly damaged) could have done the same thing, and may do it again. I concur with the Fahrenheit folks and change out the auger also

 

Yes.

The POF light sensors were a nightmare.....Far too many false shutdowns due to dirty sensors.

A lot of the optical sensors were are relegated to the trash bin and a thermal snap switch installed to replace the unreliable parts.

In my experience the biggest issue with the newer pellet stoves is engineers that are overly excited about fancy electronic gizmos.

A pellet stove is a very simple device if allowed to be so.

What they need.
Fuel
Air
A few temp safeties
A door switch safety
Stack overtemp safety
Low limit (no fire) safety
Control timers......
What do we need
When do we need it
How much of it do we need

(The timers control the auger feed time and the auger off time (HOW BIG OR SMALL OF A FIRE)
The micro electronics and way too much of them are usually the issue.

Another problem area is STATIC DISCHARGE

Walk up to the stove during cold dry weather (HIGH STATIC ELECTRICITY)
Grab the control knob/switch ZAP...The micro components just got hit with a static discharge.......
THE PLAN....
ALWAYS TOUCH THE STOVE CHASSIS / BODY BEFORE TOUCHING THE CONTROL SWITCHES....

 

Yes
A failing/ as in too heavy of an amp draw.....can ruin a board.

An Auger that is bound up with pellets, has a stiff, dry set of bushings....or worn bushings that cause the auger to bind or drag can contribute to high amperage draw.

MOST controllers DO NOT HAVE a separate fuse for each component (Auger motor, draft fan, convection fan) and the auger motor can hog too many amps and fry the tiny circuit that feeds it.....

My custom controller has a 2 amp fuse for each of the components.
The relays and timers are all rated at 15-20 amp loads.....
The micro controllers are just not capable of handling any anomalies that stress them much above nominal.....

 

I sure appreciate that info Snowy. Separate fuses makes a lot of sense.

You say a pellet stove is simple in essence; I agree they are simple in concept, but it has a fair few moving parts and those parts are up against dust and irregulars of organic (solid) material. I suppose its all relative. Compared to a woodstove, it doesn't seem simple. Maybe simple compared to some new-age oil burners, but those have the benefit of a more regular fuel and a bigger industry to debug bad design (maybe).

The claims that the board is the last component to fail doesn't seem to hold true in my case, but that could be an anomaly, or it could be that my auger motor was bad beneath it's skin and was the true culprit (though it looked and sounded fine). Either way, I've replaced the auger motor and have a new board. So far so good. Fingers crossed.

 

Thanks Ssyko, I agree about replacing the motor (just did it).
I'm not sure I agree about the ghost voltage. I'm not an electrical engineer, but there's two reasons why I say that:
1) because Fahrenheit shows that this 120 voltage (when read without a load) is normal. You can watch their auger timeout troubleshooting video to confirm this.
2) Certain components on the board (i'm not positive if it's the traic itself, but I assume any semiconductor may allow this) can leak enough to read voltage if the measurement device is high enough impedance. See this thread for an example of people talking about said issue: Meter reads voltage anyways... [Text] - PLCS.net - Interactive Q & A

Perhaps this is particular to the Fahrenheit board arrangement and not a generic CB phenomenon.

 

This is true, readings all depends on the test equipment being used. I am no engineer just a hobbyist. I have never had a chance to work on a board from Fahrenheit and im assuming it is a dual voltage like most others 5-15vdc for low voltage control over 115-800vac. The triacs are the bridge between low and high voltage, Ac & Dc. a situation of a no load, any ghost voltage should be in the millivolt or nano volts range which would have no affect on any functions. Some components do allow a forward voltage even diodes. Average field test equipment will do for most troubleshooting 41/2 digits, more precise measurements you would need 51/2-61/2 digits. I have a cheap HF DMM in my stove bag with nothing being tested it reads .3 millivolts lol. So yes if they call that a ghost voltage I can’t argue that.

the link you posted was a very good read thanks. 3phase high voltage i stay clear of