In loving memory of Kenis D. Keathley 6/4/81 - 3/27/22 Loving father, husband, brother, friend and firewood hoarder Rest in peace, Dexterday

MS441 vs MS460

Discussion in 'Chainsaws and Power Equipment' started by Woodporn, Jan 6, 2014.

  1. Woodporn

    Woodporn

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    Will I like it more than the 660?
    It's a toss up between a 460 and a 441
     
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  2. DexterDay

    DexterDay Administrator

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    Between those 2?

    I say 460 (461 now because of the AV). The 461 has much more out of the box power and still has the good AV the 441 has.

    The 441 is a great saw. But for out of the box power, the 460/461 is Nasty.

    Put a dual port on it and be prepared for the smile you can't wipe off your face. :D

    460/461 is just as fast as a 660 in wood under 25". Over that is where the 660 shines.
     
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  3. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    What version of the 441? If it's not a C-M then I'd pass in favor of the 460.

    A 441/460/461 is gonna be a lot nicer to use in wood up to 24". The 660 really doesn't have any advantage until the wood/bars get big. A stock MS460 with a dual-port muffler runs a 28" bar with authority. And weighs a good bit less than a 660. The 660 is also a saw that doesn't realize it's true potential without a bit of work.

    The 461 can't hold a candle to the 441 as far as AV goes. Totally different chassis. The 441 is a spring based AV system while the 461 is pretty much the same rubber AV mount setup found on the 460. I got real excited about the MS461 when it first came out but I was disappointed when I got it in my hands. It was a cleaner running MS460, that's it. Old-tech rubber mounted AV and no M-tronic. :( It's a power monster for sure and that's why you're buying it. I ran a nice 461 (I wish I could remember whose!) up against my OEM MS460 with a DP muffler (now Certified's saw) and both myself and the owner of the 461 were hard pressed to pick a winner for power. In fact, it feels a lot like you're running the same saw.

    I bought my 441 both for the tech and the power potential. I've been told repeatedly that Randy's 441's pretty much own the 70 cc category by a fair margin and make owning a stock 90cc for firewood totally unnecessary.

    WoodPorn, if you already have a 660, I say try a MS441C-M. It shines in many areas the 660 does not (efficiency, ergonomics) and is a pleasure to run for a long day. Leave a long bar on the 660 for the monsters, stick a 20"-25" on the 441 and make it your daily driver. ;)

    Of course, if you can hold off until May (the FHC g2g) you will have a most excellent opportunity to run a 441/460/461 and decide for yourself.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2014
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  4. Woodporn

    Woodporn

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    I wish going to the gtg was an option...Maybe if there is a N.E. division gtg I'd be able to attend.
    The 441 was an M, but I slept too long on that one and lost out.
    The 460 is an older model, no specifics given on options. maybe you could tell from the picture??
    Where do I obtain these said DP covers? would I need to have it retuned? My 660 is barely even broken in (10-12 tanks through it) and I'm only running a 25"

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. clemsonfor

    clemsonfor

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    Look up HL supply on eBay he sells HY Way versions of them
    That's where I got my 660 dp cover.

    Its also an option from stihl but have heard anywhere from $45-70 for just cover. I paid $20 for the front cover give or take on the bay. I saw that he either has whole 440 or 460 mufflers with dp cover for about the same. It works just as the stihl does.

    All Australian 660 come factory with cover. Thanks EPA!!

    And yes on a retune. I had my 660 so fat it stock form that i did not have to retune it bit it was FAT before!!
     
  6. clemsonfor

    clemsonfor

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    Yea but what can randy do to a 660!!! Want to see that 661 that he does.
     
  7. Woodporn

    Woodporn

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    Thanks Clem,
    MM do you sell?
    If so what does inventory look like?
    PM me if you'd rather...
     
  8. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    That saw has an aftermarket clutch cover, and it's the larger version from a wrap-handle saw (MS460R). The back handle appears to have been replaced (no stickers) and the forward handle is newer than the saw as well. There's nothing wrong with any of that either, just my observations. This saw may have been rebuilt after being dropped or crushed.

    Not much difference in the 460 from beginning of the run to the end.

    As for those DP covers:

    Hyway muffler for the 044/440, 046/460

    Hyway muffler for the 066/650/660

    I would do the entire aftermarket muffler because just adding the DP cover doesn't open up the original opening on the can to the appropriate size for maximum performance.

    I don't normally stock/sell parts like these. But I have been known to help obtain difficult items for one reason or another. ;)
     
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  9. Woodporn

    Woodporn

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    Thanks for the insight on the saw...I'd have never picked up on those.
    Was not asking about parts, more curious if you sell refurb saws.
     
  10. DexterDay

    DexterDay Administrator

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    Randy is the only reason I bought my 441C-M. Because of what he does to them. With that said, it will obviously be making a trip to Tn.
     
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  11. clemsonfor

    clemsonfor

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    Is A masterminded 441 stronger than a masterminded 460?
     
  12. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    Occasionally when I have them. I do much more repair work (which is actually more demanding schedule wise) but I do sell some fixxer-uppers on occasion. The used saw market around here has been awful lately tho. Can't find anything worth buying as a project and the dealers look at you like you just asked them for their first-born when you ask about carcasses.

    Anybody that finds a saw they want to resurrect is welcome to send it or if you really want me to hunt something down (time permitting) I might be able to work something up. I'm going to have to work out a deal with Scotty for site sponsorship. :)

    Current inventory is my 034 and 031, kinda on the fence about what I wannt to do with either one of them. The 034 may be spoken for but it's not firm.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2014
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  13. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    Rather than derail the FHC SS thread further, you guys will notice I pulled the MS441/460/461 posts and made a new thread. :)
     
  14. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    Spike60 (not a member here but he's out there on a few well-known sites) has a great g2g about an hour north of me every year in the early fall. A ways off but a great day if you can make it.
     
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  15. mdavlee

    mdavlee

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    I weighed the 460 and 660 I have the other day and there was a 1.8 lb difference between them and the 660 had a 32" stihl es wide nose bar and the 460 a 28" carlton. I would guess the real world weight full of fluids is around a lb with the same size bar. The 460 can be made to out cut a 660 up to 28" wood or so. The 660 shines when you need a 36" bar and after they've been modded. For a stock 90cc saw it's pitiful. The 461 is more impressive. A stock 441 is a little behind a 460 and ahead of a 440.
     
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  16. MasterMech

    MasterMech The Mechanical Moderator

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    I'm surprised to hear that considering all the hoopla around Stihl's "little" 70cc machine.
     
  17. mdavlee

    mdavlee

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    I like a 440 the best out of those 3 as I've not had any time with a ported 441. The 440 I can use like a 50 cc saw all day. I've used one and burnt 2.5-3 gallons in one in a day. Too bad they fetch such a premium now.
     
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  18. DexterDay

    DexterDay Administrator

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    They are both 71cc? I think my 044 had more Pazazz than the 441, but it had dual port cover and many tanks ran through it to break it in.

    I won't be a 441 hater forever. Once it sees its way to Tn, I'm sure I will change my mind.
     
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  19. Woodporn

    Woodporn

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    OK I lost out on the 460, it hit $575 and I was out...
    Eyeing an 044 now
     
  20. DexterDay

    DexterDay Administrator

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    $575 isn't bad. But better be like "New" for used.